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#1 | ||
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,811
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Question. If a bankrupt person is not allowed to hold political office, should the unemployed be allowed to vote?
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#3 | ||
Kicking back
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Western sydney
Posts: 8,576
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They should be able to. Not all are unemployed by choice and many held active roles in society. Even the "dole bludger" should still have the right to have a say in what parties policies they find are best for the country. On the other hand a bankrupt polly could be seen as a person (who likely has) mismanaged funds to end up in the hole. Not very good if tasked with managing the country's debt
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#4 | ||
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,811
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The question popped into my head concerning Rod Culleton's bankruptcy and resulting ineligibility to be a senate representative. So I asked if you can't serve while bankrupt, should those drawing unemployment also be ineligible to have a vote. Both presumably have no economic power..
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#5 | ||
FG XR6 Ute & Sedan
![]() Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Bibra Lake WA
Posts: 23,026
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Are we talking about his financial or morality bankruptcy?
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#6 | |||
WT GT
![]() Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: The GSS
Posts: 17,764
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Quote:
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#7 | |||
Kicking back
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Western sydney
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Quote:
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#8 | |||
FG XR6 Ute & Sedan
![]() Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Bibra Lake WA
Posts: 23,026
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Section 44 of the Constitution re Disqualification
Any person who…. (iii) is an undischarged bankrupt or insolvent…. …. shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a Senator or a Member of the House of Representatives…. Following on from section 44 is another section stipulating how a Member or Senators position becomes vacant after taking advantage of the insolvency and bankruptcy laws that have been enacted in Australia: Section 45 Vacancy on happening of disqualification If a senator or member of the House of Representatives…. (ii) takes the benefit, whether by assignment, composition, or otherwise, of any law relating to bankrupt or insolvent debtors; or his place shall thereupon become vacant. per: http://www.cefa.org.au/ccf/why-can%E...sit-parliament Quote:
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#10 | ||
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,811
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All I was asking is that if one cannot lead if one is economically unable, should one be able to have a say in the direction of the country's government while one is presumably economically unable.
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#11 | |||
Donating Member
![]() Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Morayfield
Posts: 27,946
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Quote:
What about disability? What about part time workers? And if I earn lots can I vote twice?
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#12 | ||||
FG XR6 Ute & Sedan
![]() Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Bibra Lake WA
Posts: 23,026
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Quote:
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#13 | ||
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,811
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#14 | ||
*barks incessantly
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: SA
Posts: 1,556
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I wrote a long post, frowned at the OP and then deleted what I was going to write.
I can't even. |
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#15 | |||
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,811
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Quote:
Or are we only allowed to ask questions that will keep the usual echo chamber of the supporters of a particular narrative in virtue signalling, in agreement??? |
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#16 | |||
^^^^^^^^
![]() ![]() Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: online - duh
Posts: 9,634
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Quote:
![]() Governments are there for all society and their role is FAR more than just managing the economy. Something many seem to get confused about these days, including the pollies. Employed/Unemployed you're still part of the broader society that will be influenced by government policy. So yes, the unemployed deserve a vote as much as anyone else. .
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#17 | ||
Au Falcon = Mr Reliable
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: North West Slopes & Plains NSW
Posts: 4,076
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Dignity is not preserve of the rich or privileged nor is destiny...neither is luck. Ring up the Salvo's or Vinnies & ask how important unemployed volunteers are to them. Are bankrupts still allowed to vote lol? Lets stop them too then ha ha lol!
cheer's, Maka
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Ford AU Series Magazine Scans Here - www.fordforums.com.au/photos/index.php?cat=2792 Proud owner of a optioned keeper S1 Tickford Falcon AU XR6 VCT - "it's actually a better-balanced car than the XR8, goes almost as hard and uses about two-thirds of the fuel" (Drive.com 2007) |
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#18 | ||
*barks incessantly
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: SA
Posts: 1,556
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#19 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Taromeo
Posts: 10,479
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Being unemployed is a totally different kettle of fish to being an undischarged bankrupt, just as holding a political position and being able to vote are totally different.
I'm not sure how you could even think of both in the same thought. Being unemployed shouldn't take away your rights as a voter. |
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#20 | ||
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,811
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I have worked and paid taxes all my life, since I left school many years ago. In that time, many in a generation of able bodied men have chosen to become long term parasites, living off the cream of other people's wealth. Why should they get the same voting rights???
And while you are sputtering with indignation at the very nerve of me asking such a question, give me facts as to why you disagree, not emotional feel good virtue signalling rhetoric... |
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#21 | |||
Donating Member
![]() Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Morayfield
Posts: 27,946
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Quote:
Here is what we can do 1: Work out someone's net position in regards to the financial contribution to Australia. That would be taxes paid - minus benefits like child supplement, medical costs etc. 2: Apportion voting based on the net contribution. So someone paying say $20K in tax PA gets 1 Vote, someone paying $80K in tax gets 4 votes. 3: Corporations pay tax too. Allow them to vote? Seriously, voting is your right of citizenship. I don't begrudge it going to help those that need help. Start a thread on polly perks and I'll be right there cheering you on!!!
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#22 | |||
Thailand Specials
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Centrefold Lounge
Posts: 49,084
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Quote:
If they want to sit back and collect their piddly tax payer money then let them, they're not living the life of luxury. Have a look at how many jobs are going and how many unemployed and or underemployed people there are. The numbers are hugely different, i'd rather focus on job creation, infrastructure projects nation wide, 457 visa rorting and wage exploitation rather than worrying about some douche collecting $270 a week or what ever it is on the dole (who are in the minority). Too much worrying about losing $270 from some lazy sod rather than Apple, Google, Microsoft and mining companies paying SFA and me and you paying for them. If anyone disagrees with my opinions then I offer the other option of a communist dictatorship with me as the evil leader, I'll make you guys do all the work, take the rewards and eventually be murdered by rebels funded and armed by the USA when I tell Apple to GAGF ![]() |
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#23 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Taromeo
Posts: 10,479
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Quote:
Here's a quote from J Baker, one of the original advocates for voting rights in South Australia - "A man came here to benefit himself and his family and the fact that a large family prevented a man from acquiring property is no reason why he should be disenfranchised." This is from the HRC - "A healthy democracy makes sure that all members of the community have equal access to the political process. Australia is a democratic nation where governments are elected by popular vote. However, even though almost all Australians over 18 years old have the right – and the obligation – to vote, not all Australians enjoy that right as a practical matter." Date: 2010 |
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#24 | |||
All Bran = Regular Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: BrizVegas
Posts: 1,970
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Quote:
If so, you're a shoe-in ![]()
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#25 | ||
Kicking back
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Western sydney
Posts: 8,576
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I agree, I make more then alot I know who are smarter then myself, that doesn't mean I'm a wealthy person at all, I still go week to week on pays. My old man is probably the smartest man I know, took some massive risks in the late 90's to start (with 2 other colleges) a company that now has over 350 franchises in all mainland states (not sure about tasmania). He made his millions and retired 13 years ago at 50. Yes he is more in depth with politics then myself, but not working for years doesn't mean he cannot have his say, and the fact he has money then me means he has no more of a say then me. I would cut my right arm off to just get the dividends he gets once a year, but I still get my vote, because some policies will affect my situation different to his and vice versa. It's all a poll that uses all situations and their numbers and opinions to elect what is right for the people.
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#26 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 90
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Not sure what point your trying to make..
All major developed countries of the world have redistributive tax systems. According to the ABS if your not earning at least $1200 a week your taking more from the tax system than your contributing. May as well take away there right to vote too.. ![]() |
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#27 | |||
Kicking back
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Western sydney
Posts: 8,576
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Quote:
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#28 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Adelaide
Posts: 1,605
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The rich person also spends more on basics like groceries and eating out, let's face it, the more you earn the more you spend, they contribute more to gst for treasury.
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#29 | ||
Banned
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Posts: 8,303
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#30 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Canberra
Posts: 13,393
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Well when you think about it, it is the most vulnerable vote that matters most so they should absolutely have a vote. People steal to get by otherwise.
I'd much rather pay for it than have to rely on it to live. I spent nearly $5k on my holiday so I know where I want to be. |
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