Clem 7 Speed Camera's..Police Caught Out!!!!

csv8 · 29-07-2011, 10:43 PM

I know this another speed camera posting and I will be doggy do do'ed again ..but ...This another reason why I hate speed cameras, when Police can do this, But this time they didn't get away with it!!!
Courier Mail 29/07/2011
The number of speeding fines issued by fixed cameras in the Clem7 Tunnel soared by almost 50 per cent in May after a law was quietly changed.

More than 3600 fines were sent out to drivers who used the tunnel in May, compared with an average of 2100 in each of the previous nine months.

More than 500 were later withdrawn when it was found a roadworker had erected speed signs in the wrong place.

Police revealed to The Courier-Mail yesterday the reason for the sudden upswing in speeding offences detected in the tunnel was a regulation change in section 210c of the Transport Operations Act that allowed the enforcement of variable speed limits.

Before the change, police could not enforce limits lower than 80km/h displayed by variable speed signs in the Clem7 without manually adjusting fixed cameras each time.

falconnut · 29-07-2011, 11:07 PM

I am sure it was a 'accident' (on purpose)

gencer · 29-07-2011, 11:28 PM

OMG so over it!!! :s

TheInterceptor · 29-07-2011, 11:34 PM

Somebody needs to discharge an EMP into that tunnel...then again it would kill all these modern cars too.

last fairlane · 29-07-2011, 11:48 PM

The most useless piece of ****** that Cando ever thought up
how many millions to build it
and the cost dont listen to the news or read the papers
its not $2.90 or $3.90 its $11 for a truck
the scenario
Gold coast to the Airport

drive along the M1 motorway from Surfers Paradise
in a semi trailer/tray truck or even a Hilux ute
you get to the Gabba and you have a choice
use the Clem7 tunnel or the Inner City Bypass
today I will try the tunnel $11 cost and 80kph limit
tomorrow the ICB 80kph limit and no cost
OK what about traffic lights
same scenario
M1 to the Gabba
use Clem7
no traffic lights between the Gabba
and Kingsford Smith drive all fine
same scenario
but use ICB to Kingsford Smith drive
have a guess
no traffic lights
one costs $11 the other zilch
where do Pollys get their info from
I dont think they ever drove a car/truck
from the south side to the north side
or they could have saved
hundreds of millions
thats my rant
John

2011G6E · 30-07-2011, 09:04 AM

I still want to know if there's a "delay" when you are going past a sign and it suddenly changes. I assume it doesn't flash for a while to warn you that it's about to change?
As I gave the example before of the coloured lights we have as train signals, it's perfectly possible for one to change to "drop out" to red (a technical fault) just as you are going past but before the wheels of the locomotive have hit the track circuit underneath you, where the signal is out of sight. Technically, you have just comitted a very serious safety breach: a SPAD..."Signal Passed At Danger"...however in this case it's not your fault as it's a technical fault, but you still have to stop the train every time you see a red light. Control then calls on the radio and asks if you were aware that last signal dropped out as you went past. Usually you see it happen, but sometimes you don't, and control usually aren't happy about it...not your fault, you didn't see it happen.
So with these illuminated speed signs, is there a delay? Do they give some indication that they are about to change? Or do you just ignore foolish stuff like watching where you are going and instead keep staring at the sign until it passes out of view beside you?
If it changes a couple of seconds before you pass it, then until you see the next sign, you will be blissfully unaware that you are speeding. I would assume this would be the perfect trap.

I'll be driving down that way in a couple of weeks, and while I'll have the sat nav in the G6E turned to "avoid toll roads" there mightn't be a choice at times and I'd like to know what to expect...

ray38l · 30-07-2011, 09:30 AM

Being able to drive on a road that we pay for isn't an amazing privilege. Its a right that every Australian that meets the criteria has as long as they pass the relevant test and pay there donation to the government.
People don't hate authority in general. Peoples attitude towards the government is to keep them honest. If people didn't complain imagine what this country would be like today. We wouldn't have the freedom we do now.
this thread will end up locked like all the other speed camera ones.

jpd80 · 30-07-2011, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ray38l

dumbest post i have ever read.
Being able to drive on a road that we pay for isn't an amazing privilege. Its a right that every Australian that meets the criteria has as long as they pass the relevant test and pay there donation to the government.

I am of the opinion that highway speed limits should be increased especially on divided highways
but equally convinced that RTA and policing be more concerned with unsafe acts in built up areas.

BadMax · 30-07-2011, 11:09 AM

Don't you just love it when the law abiding do gooders come get on to one of these threads and start preaching

Seriously, try living in Victoria with all these BS cameras, it's bloody horrible! How about teching people how to drive not how to get a licence surely this would prove far more valuable than getting a ticket for speeding by 3kmh!

IIRC, Sweden has an extremely low road toll, why? Because they teach people to drive not because of revenue raising 'safety cameras'.

Matty4 · 30-07-2011, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kpcart

guys, get over yourselves, dont speed and you have nothing to complain about speed cameras.

So you are saying all these people need to get over themselves...

http://www.couriermail.com.au/busine...-1226094910715

Quote:

HUNDREDS of speeding fines issued in Brisbane's Clem7 tunnel have been torn up by police in response to complaints from drivers and incorrectly placed speed limit signs.

The Queensland Police Service yesterday revealed 541 infringement notices issued when the speed in the tunnel was reduced to under 80km/h had since been withdrawn.

But the QPS was unable to say how many fines had been issued in the past two months when outrage over the speeding tickets erupted.

Thousands of motorists are believed to have been snapped when variable speed limit signs in the tunnel were suddenly reduced to 40km/h in response to "incidents" such as breakdowns and roadworks.

The Courier-Mail revealed last month that tunnel motorists had been fined up to $933 after being snapped doing 80km/h when the speed limit was suddenly cut to 40km/h.

Dozens of motorists had raised concerns about the poorly signed speed limits and said the fines were unfair.

All those preaching about just playing by the rules and you won't have a problem.............ask yourself...........are THEY playing by the rules too???...

It appears not.

bingoTE50 · 30-07-2011, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadMax

Don't you just love it when the law abiding do gooders come get on to one of these threads and start preaching

IIRC, Sweden has an extremely low road toll, why? Because they teach people to drive not because of revenue raising 'safety cameras'.

Must be Volvo's surely .. I agree with you , driver training surely is the key.
Unfortunately , the one biggest argument the said do-gooders have is - Don't speed . A valid point and indefendable if you have been caught and I am one of them. But does that make a dangerous & reckless driver? If so ? ,why am I actually typing this. Maybe I am a Mr Magoo and leave a trail of destruction behind me ? My late father in law used always say ," never been in an accident in forty years " , and my reply was " geez you've left some behind you though ! " How many Mc Goos are out there ? I have seen a few !! Wrong way around roundabouts , running red lights, pulling out on people , no indicators , wrong way up a one way street , burnouts in traffic , endless !!!
Has a speed camera caught them - not at that point in time !

flappist · 30-07-2011, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bingoTE50

Must be Volvo's surely .. I agree with you , driver training surely is the key.
Unfortunately , the one biggest argument the said do-gooders have is - Don't speed . A valid point and indefendable if you have been caught and I am one of them. But does that make a dangerous & reckless driver? If so ? ,why am I actually typing this. Maybe I am a Mr Magoo and leave a trail of destruction behind me ? My late father in law used always say ," never been in an accident in forty years " , and my reply was " geez you've left some behind you though ! " How many Mc Goos are out there ? I have seen a few !! Wrong way around roundabouts , running red lights, pulling out on people , no indicators , wrong way up a one way street , burnouts in traffic , endless !!!
Has a speed camera caught them - not at that point in time !

Indefensible?

You too have been caught up in the propaganda trap.

The Govco/dogooder definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is higher than a number on a sign regardless of any other influence"

The real definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is greater than is safe for the conditions".

The Govco/dogooders will argue that the safe speed is the one on the sign as this fits into their agenda but on occasion will state that travelling less than the number on the sign can be safer.

When asked how it is possible for a section of road to be safe at a number on a sign and then 10 minutes later when that sign has been changed to a lower of higher number they will change the subject or attack you personally.

One thing you will notice on here is that all the dogooder trolls have several things in common.

1) They are all very secretive about who they are, what they do, what they drive.
2) They make very few positive contributions to the forum and tend to just lurk about in their private hobby horse area picking fights.
3) They never actually back up any of their points with anything other than the same propaganda over and over again and denounce anything that contradicts their position by attacking the protagonist rather than the argument.

In short they appear to be unhappy malcontents who use the anonymity of the internet to live out a fantasy in which they are successful powerful influential leaders and decision makers rather than the pathetic individuals they are in real life and are extremely paranoid about revealing anything about themselves that would destroy this fantasy.

The good news is the forum evolves and the dogooder trolls come and go on a regular basis sometimes just changing their user name after they have been outed.

The best thing to do is completely ignore them as they need someone to fight with to keep their fantasy alive.

GASWAGON · 30-07-2011, 12:09 PM

Someone needs to stand at the front of this tunnel with a sign saying "THEY'RE RIPPING US OFF... THIS TUNNEL IS RIGGED"!

bingoTE50 · 30-07-2011, 12:10 PM

Flappist I agree with pretty much all your thoughts on the subject .
My point about the indefence is that if you are caught the pro-camera brigade always give the simple answer , if you keep under the speed limit you will not be photographed, and on face value we all know that is correct ,however for the fleeting moment of circumstance , and I believe many are circumstantial , the point shoved down our throat is not correct.
THE Clem Seven is a point in view,so many people getting caught out and the justification is that it is a safety exercise . I cannot believe it at all, to my knowledge I have not heard of any mass pileup that maimed and killed in the Clem seven. It is not because of the cameras as plenty have been caught , so what is it ? Luck ? If the cameras are positioned because of road safety and people are still being caught why are there not masses of accidents at the black spot that they are supposed to protect?
Beyond my pea brain..

Matty4 · 30-07-2011, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

Indefensible?

You too have been caught up in the propaganda trap.

The Govco/dogooder definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is higher than a number on a sign regardless of any other influence"

The real definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is greater than is safe for the conditions".

The Govco/dogooders will argue that the safe speed is the one on the sign as this fits into their agenda but on occasion will state that travelling less than the number on the sign can be safer.

When asked how it is possible for a section of road to be safe at a number on a sign and then 10 minutes later when that sign has been changed to a lower of higher number they will change the subject or attack you personally.

One thing you will notice on here is that all the dogooder trolls have several things in common.

1) They are all very secretive about who they are, what they do, what they drive.
2) They make very few positive contributions to the forum and tend to just lurk about in their private hobby horse area picking fights.
3) They never actually back up any of their points with anything other than the same propaganda over and over again and denounce anything that contradicts their position by attacking the protagonist rather than the argument.

In short they appear to be unhappy malcontents who use the anonymity of the internet to live out a fantasy in which they are successful powerful influential leaders and decision makers rather than the pathetic individuals they are in real life and are extremely paranoid about revealing anything about themselves that would destroy this fantasy.

The good news is the forum evolves and the dogooder trolls come and go on a regular basis sometimes just changing their user name after they have been outed.

The best thing to do is completely ignore them as they need someone to fight with to keep their fantasy alive.

^^^
This.........in a nutshell!!

**Grunter** · 30-07-2011, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

Rational thoughts

Well said.

BadMax · 30-07-2011, 12:56 PM

So, on the way into work this morning I'm travelling at the sign posted speed which is 80kph, I see two vehicles in the left lane which I'm travelling in (doing the right thing and keeping left). I notice the lead car is travelling slow, as I get closer I prepare to change lanes but the second car beat me to it.
This is fine, but now I'm stuck in the left lane, 80kph zone, car is travelling at a dangerous 58kph and the second car which moved into the right lane is also travelling at 58kph.
Now tell me what is safe about travelling at 58kph in and 80 zone with vehicle approaching both at 80kph? Another vehicle in right lane became impatient and tailgated the right car, cut off the left car and then proceeded to cut the right car off. Were the actions called for? No. But it's these situations the 'do gooders' don't realise they are causing. If you can't keep pace with the traffic, get off the road!
The road conditions were dry and sunny with very little traffic.

**Luke Plaizier** · 30-07-2011, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

Indefensible?

You too have been caught up in the propaganda trap.

The Govco/dogooder definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is higher than a number on a sign regardless of any other influence"

The real definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is greater than is safe for the conditions".

The Govco/dogooders will argue that the safe speed is the one on the sign as this fits into their agenda but on occasion will state that travelling less than the number on the sign can be safer.

When asked how it is possible for a section of road to be safe at a number on a sign and then 10 minutes later when that sign has been changed to a lower of higher number they will change the subject or attack you personally.

One thing you will notice on here is that all the dogooder trolls have several things in common.

1) They are all very secretive about who they are, what they do, what they drive.
2) They make very few positive contributions to the forum and tend to just lurk about in their private hobby horse area picking fights.
3) They never actually back up any of their points with anything other than the same propaganda over and over again and denounce anything that contradicts their position by attacking the protagonist rather than the argument.

In short they appear to be unhappy malcontents who use the anonymity of the internet to live out a fantasy in which they are successful powerful influential leaders and decision makers rather than the pathetic individuals they are in real life and are extremely paranoid about revealing anything about themselves that would destroy this fantasy.

The good news is the forum evolves and the dogooder trolls come and go on a regular basis sometimes just changing their user name after they have been outed.

The best thing to do is completely ignore them as they need someone to fight with to keep their fantasy alive.

That's one hell of a way to ignore someone. And a great way to sidestep the whole discussion and just attack the poster.

Next time you probably should just ignore it.

As long as we can go about our business talking avidly to passengers, or fiddling around with in car iPod playlists, or playing music loud, or jiggering through in-car colour display 8" LCD menu systems, or talking away on our hands free phone, we know we'll all be perfectly safe as long as we stay under the speed limit...

I also wonder. If they just called them revenue cameras, and stopped the pretence that they improve safety, I think we'd all be happier that at least they are being honest about it.

Lukeyson

**Luke Plaizier** · 30-07-2011, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadMax

So, on the way into work this morning I'm travelling at the sign posted speed which is 80kph, I see two vehicles in the left lane which I'm travelling in (doing the right thing and keeping left). I notice the lead car is travelling slow, as I get closer I prepare to change lanes but the second car beat me to it.
This is fine, but now I'm stuck in the left lane, 80kph zone, car is travelling at a dangerous 58kph and the second car which moved into the right lane is also travelling at 58kph.
Now tell me what is safe about travelling at 58kph in and 80 zone with vehicle approaching both at 80kph? Another vehicle in right lane became impatient and tailgated the right car, cut off the left car and then proceeded to cut the right car off. Were the actions called for? No. But it's these situations the 'do gooders' don't realise they are causing. If you can't keep pace with the traffic, get off the road!
The road conditions were dry and sunny with very little traffic.

I'm not sure how that relates to the OP. But yes, there are a lot of people on the roads these days with poor driving etiquette. I've had friends from overseas comment about how poor the 'keep left unless overtaking' behaviour is in Australia, or how people don't let you in on lane merges - all the little things.

But that's a good point. Perhaps an advertising campaign promoting polite driving behaviour might help. After all, there'd be enough camera revenue to pay for that now wouldn't there. (See what I did there?)

Lukeyson

Jim Goose · 30-07-2011, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadMax

So, on the way into work this morning I'm travelling at the sign posted speed which is 80kph, I see two vehicles in the left lane which I'm travelling in (doing the right thing and keeping left). I notice the lead car is travelling slow, as I get closer I prepare to change lanes but the second car beat me to it.
This is fine, but now I'm stuck in the left lane, 80kph zone, car is travelling at a dangerous 58kph and the second car which moved into the right lane is also travelling at 58kph.
Now tell me what is safe about travelling at 58kph in and 80 zone with vehicle approaching both at 80kph? Another vehicle in right lane became impatient and tailgated the right car, cut off the left car and then proceeded to cut the right car off. Were the actions called for? No. But it's these situations the 'do gooders' don't realise they are causing. If you can't keep pace with the traffic, get off the road!
The road conditions were dry and sunny with very little traffic.

While driving below the posted speed limit is an annoyance, particularly in peak hour, THERE IS NO LAW SAYING YOU MUST DRIVE AT 80kmh in an 80kmh zone.
You said yourself you saw the car driving slow... so how was it dangerous?
If you were on a blind corner at 80kmh and suddenly come up to a car doing 40kmh then yes that is a dangerous situtation.
Driving SLOW isnt a dangerous thing to do. Use some logic in an arguement instead of just saying every who drives slow is dangerous.
The whole arguement about "speeding" is that everyone who "speeds" is dangerous, when clearly IS ISNT... and your using the SAME arguement... EVERYONE driving slow is dangerous....

GhiaEB · 30-07-2011, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

While driving below the posted speed limit is an annoyance, particularly in peak hour, THERE IS NO LAW SAYING YOU MUST DRIVE AT 80kmh in an 80kmh zone.
You said yourself you saw the car driving slow... so how was it dangerous?
If you were on a blind corner at 80kmh and suddenly come up to a car doing 40kmh then yes that is a dangerous situtation.
Driving SLOW isnt a dangerous thing to do. Use some logic in an arguement instead of just saying every who drives slow is dangerous.
The whole arguement about "speeding" is that everyone who "speeds" is dangerous, when clearly IS ISNT... and your using the SAME arguement... EVERYONE driving slow is dangerous....

In WA I beleave it is against the law for you to be driving 20kph below the speed limit without just cause. Not that it is ever enforced.

Cheers

gtxb67 · 30-07-2011, 03:16 PM

flappist - i normally always agree with you - and no, this isn't one of the times i do not, but even when i do not, i am still impressed that all of your posts seem to be consistent whether you are personally affected or not. that is certainly worthy of my respect. most seem to only care when it affects them and if it does not, they do not seem to care - not you though. maybe it is because of your personal experience through life, but if you think something is unfair to even a small number of people, you stick up for them - kudos

cobramania · 30-07-2011, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

While driving below the posted speed limit is an annoyance, particularly in peak hour, THERE IS NO LAW SAYING YOU MUST DRIVE AT 80kmh in an 80kmh zone.
You said yourself you saw the car driving slow... so how was it dangerous?
If you were on a blind corner at 80kmh and suddenly come up to a car doing 40kmh then yes that is a dangerous situtation.
Driving SLOW isnt a dangerous thing to do. Use some logic in an arguement instead of just saying every who drives slow is dangerous.
The whole arguement about "speeding" is that everyone who "speeds" is dangerous, when clearly IS ISNT... and your using the SAME arguement... EVERYONE driving slow is dangerous....

I see what you're getting at, & it maybe different from state to state, but can't you get booked for going too slow in a speed zone, creating a traffic hazard & potential dangerous situation, similar to what has been eluded, (what would've happened if this occurred in the tunnel & one of the cars being cut off or weaving in & out scraped/hit the tunnel wall & lost control)?
22kph under in an 80 zone is annoying & dangerous, 22kph under in a 40 zone is just annoying.
Given the forums we're in, take a look on the racetrack, even right up to F1, to qualify you have to be within a % of the pole position (top qualifying) time, otherwise the speed difference between the cars is dangerous, most of the time on the racetrack you know the other drivers, & know what they're going to or likely to do, on the street you don't.

Speed Cameras don't address this dangerous situation, a Highway Patrol Police car & officer would.

GASWAGON · 30-07-2011, 03:22 PM

This thread is not about driver etiquette....it's about the Police ADMITTING they INCORRECTLY fined hundreds of people for thousands of dollars using a camera system that is now PROVEN to operate in a deliberatly inconspicuous manner to make speed zones confusing in order to gain profits... NOT safety... When the hell are people going to get serious about this stuff that's going on???
People are losing licenses and going into debt paying these fines while the gov's are sitting back raking in millions.....!!!!!!!!!

In Melbourne they're proposing to outlay 3000 more camera's.... And i AM NOT happy about it! End rant

Jim Goose · 30-07-2011, 04:41 PM

Ok... so driving slow is dangerous... driving fast is dangerous too... make up your minds? You cant argue using the same point that driving slow is dangerous ... just like when the adds say speeding is dangerous.

The point being made was that someone going slow was causing an obstruction in an 80kmh zone while going 60kmh.... Ok so what is the difference if I am doing 110 in a 100 zone and someone speeding comes up behind me (and they were doing 130kmh) and then proceeds to tailgate me because IM NOT GOING FAST ENOUGH ...???

Seriously guys... its the EXACT same thing....
The problem is the attitude... your in my way!! get out of my way.... Im in a hurry... THATS what causes accidents. Impatience.

2011G6E · 30-07-2011, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

While driving below the posted speed limit is an annoyance, particularly in peak hour, THERE IS NO LAW SAYING YOU MUST DRIVE AT 80kmh in an 80kmh zone.
You said yourself you saw the car driving slow... so how was it dangerous?
If you were on a blind corner at 80kmh and suddenly come up to a car doing 40kmh then yes that is a dangerous situtation.
Driving SLOW isnt a dangerous thing to do. Use some logic in an arguement instead of just saying every who drives slow is dangerous.
The whole arguement about "speeding" is that everyone who "speeds" is dangerous, when clearly IS ISNT... and your using the SAME arguement... EVERYONE driving slow is dangerous....

Perhaps not "dangerous"...although there are plenty of cases where it would be...but it's the old cliche about "Been driving for forty years and never had an accident"...yes, but you've probably caused dozens with your snail like driving.
The highways are for the movement of vehicles, as quickly as possible and safe from place to place. If you are terrified of the pace of traffic out there on the open road, might I suggest a bus?
You haven't know frustration like sitting behind a brand new Audi A6 at 65 to 70kph on the "absolutely no overtaking" divided highway stretch posted at 90kph down towards Brisbane (near Cooroy?). You start to wish for those fender mounted machine guns like in "Black Beauty" in the movie Green Hornet...

Any follow up on my question about the "delay" on the signs in the tunnel between the time they change and when the cameras start booking people?

Antwon · 30-07-2011, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

While driving below the posted speed limit is an annoyance, particularly in peak hour, THERE IS NO LAW SAYING YOU MUST DRIVE AT 80kmh in an 80kmh zone.
You said yourself you saw the car driving slow... so how was it dangerous?
If you were on a blind corner at 80kmh and suddenly come up to a car doing 40kmh then yes that is a dangerous situtation.
Driving SLOW isnt a dangerous thing to do. Use some logic in an arguement instead of just saying every who drives slow is dangerous.
The whole arguement about "speeding" is that everyone who "speeds" is dangerous, when clearly IS ISNT... and your using the SAME arguement... EVERYONE driving slow is dangerous....

I think you should re-read badmax's post.

TheInterceptor · 30-07-2011, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

The Govco/dogooder definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is higher than a number on a sign regardless of any other influence"

The real definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is greater than is safe for the conditions".

Quoted for truth.

jpd80 · 30-07-2011, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

The Govco/dogooder definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is higher than a number on a sign regardless of any other influence"

The real definition of speeding is "Driving at a speed that is greater than is safe for the conditions".

In this instance I agree with you, speed limits by their very description are conservative, designed to have a comfortable margin of safety.

Since those limits are very conservative, how can slightly exceeding the speed limit then be deemed a gross violation of safety?

Although I am in the "obey the rules" camp, it doesn't mean that I agree with every stupid decision that comes from GovCo bureaucrats.
Even I can see that the whole road safety "exercise" has been reduced to a taxation sham and unreasonable
suspension of license for trivial matters while grossly negligent drivers seem to slip through the cracks.
Poorly designed roads with speed limit set too low, insufficient overtaking lanes all adds up to a deadly cocktail
yet none of that seems to register, perhaps our politicians need to fly less and drive our roads more...
I was shocked at how terrible a drive from Brisbane to Gladstone is these days, I'll be taking the plane in future...

SEZ213 · 30-07-2011, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

Ok... so driving slow is dangerous... driving fast is dangerous too... make up your minds? You cant argue using the same point that driving slow is dangerous ... just like when the adds say speeding is dangerous.

The point being made was that someone going slow was causing an obstruction in an 80kmh zone while going 60kmh.... Ok so what is the difference if I am doing 110 in a 100 zone and someone speeding comes up behind me (and they were doing 130kmh) and then proceeds to tailgate me because IM NOT GOING FAST ENOUGH ...???

Seriously guys... its the EXACT same thing....
The problem is the attitude... your in my way!! get out of my way.... Im in a hurry... THATS what causes accidents. Impatience.

Not necessarily. Merging onto the Warrego motorway Thursday, a fencer, complete with trailer and landcruiser ute - decided that 47km/h was a good speed to go onto the Warrego...IN FRONT OF A TRUCK! The truck managed to change lanes after quite a severe bit of braking...but then the fencer proceeded to try and lose his trailer (and potentially the rest of his vehicle) with peak hour traffic around him. The merge is 100km/h, the rest of the traffic on the highway is doing 100km/h, trying to see what's coming...is not always easy, and trying to negotiate the brain dead dip **** in front of you who's going slow enough to drive miss daisy into peak hour traffic is NOT my idea of a GOOD start to the day...

The fact is, that both ends of the scale are the problem, not just one end...if you look at a bell curve, you want them to be pretty much in the middle half, not at either end...they're not only putting their own lives at risk, but everyone elses' as well.

As to the OP and the Clem 7...well, it's a great piece of road, but you pay for it...and you really need to be pretty stringent with your driving practices in there...pretty much like most of Melbourne's roads...get used to it, or don't use it...which I think is pretty much what anyone who has been caught will be doing in future. I don't foresee it getting any better...