So I'm tired...lets supercharge something :P

[Mullett]

So Eaton M90s are stupidly cheap now. And I don't think my car goes fast enough. A natural progression? I have a feeling that it'd actually work, with a lot of fabrication...but I wonder if it's worth the effort, versus turbocharging. Looking at the midrange of a turbo, the (probable) better fuel efficiency...

versus the scream of a supercharger, the instant response, and the (probable) cheaper install. Although I'd need extractors for a supercharger...

Comments?

-RM.

[Fast Eddie]

Isn't there another European brand that has Supercharging and Turbocharging in combination? That'd be an interesting combination on a Euroford. Also, won't you need to go to an aftermarket E.C.U.?

[melbzetec]

You should be able to retune the ECU. The Powerworks supercharger (now discontinued) and the Jackson Racing Supercharger both retuned the stock ECU.

[BlackLS]

If your on a budget, perhaps get a separate dedicated ECU for fuel like a megasquirt.

[Velociraptor82]

Turbo & Supercharge now there's an idea!!!

(don't forget the nitrous!!)

[fordel]

Thats an old idea really.

Read about an MR2 with both of those hooked up many years ago.

[Mullett]

Yup, twincharging is very old, I had an AW11 MR2, and that nearly got twincharged...but these days it's barely worth it, for the weight and complexity, and with BB turbos being so good now...Interestingly though, twincharging is the basis of VWs TSI engines...(Turbo Supercharged Intercooled?)

It wasn't really what i was thinking of for my car though, more of a 'which is better' comparison between turbo and SC.

-RM.

[fordel]

I'd still go the SC, just to be different.

I would eventually like to SC the XR too.

[Fast Eddie]

Why I mentioned the TSI is that one of my relo's has just bought a VW Golf GT! I think it's got 125kw from a 1.4Lt?

[Mullett]

Yup, I heard about that. VW is advertising it as the next big thing in fuel economy and performance, and it looks like they've done their homework...I'd love to drive one

[DZFord]

Sorry to revive an old thread but Mullet, you've seen this right? (SALE!)
http://www.focussport.com/turbocharger.htm

[wodahs]

want a supercharger for the focus ? try this
http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts...tKeyField=8902

M-6066-ZX3BB*
* Designed in conjunction with Jackson Racing exclusively for Ford Racing Performance Parts
* Uses Ford calibration and electronics, no fuel or electronics add-ons
* Includes new air meter, injectors, air box, calibration, intake manifold, supercharger and belt
* All installation hardware included
* Revised calibration and Roots style blower results in instant response and a flat torque curve
* Requires shipping of stock PCM for reflash
* Increases power by approximately 45hp and 45lbs/ft. AT THE WHEELS!
* Includes all components in Big Boost Kit M-9000-ZX3

[photn]

unfortunately unless you have an LR focus 02model that supercharger wont fit the LS.

if u wanna supercharge an LS maybee try installing a SC14 which are ridiculously cheep.

Great SC and whine like buggary mmmmmmmmmmm whinee.......

anywho. would be an easy setup i assume with all that room in the LS series?

[BlackLS]

Search for kits for the Mazda3. Or utilize some of the MPS factory hardware.

[Mullett]

Originally Posted by photn

unfortunately unless you have an LR focus 02model that supercharger wont fit the LS.

if u wanna supercharge an LS maybee try installing a SC14 which are ridiculously cheep.

Great SC and whine like buggary mmmmmmmmmmm whinee.......

anywho. would be an easy setup i assume with all that room in the LS series?

SC14s are getting expensive again, but an Eaton M90 is a faaaar superior supercharger, and at the moment, almost the same price (if not cheaper). I had an SC14 on my MR2, but they're really old technology, and very inefficient. But they DO make an incredible noise, especially at 18psi :P I'll see if I can dig up an old video of my MR2...

-RM.

[wodahs]

you could always put this in , bitta gaffa tape she'll be a right fit

if all goes well itll be going in to my zh in the next week or two :

[Fredo]

Hey Mullett . . . why the Eaton M90 over the M45?

Any idea what sort of cost to expect when fitting a Supercharger?

$500,$1000, $2000?? Just ball park.

Would be noice . . . . big birthday coming up . . . . hmmm

Fredo

:

[Mullett]

Eaton M90s are just what I've seen around, I don't know much about the M45, but as long as they flow well enough, should be fine. An Autorotor or Whipple twinscrew would be king, if you wanted to pay for it.

Cost varies wildly, based mainly on how much of the work you're going to do yourself, and how much you're going to pay someone to do. Depending on placements, you'd need to fabricate an intake manifold, which would be time consuming. A turbo is probably a simper proposition, but superchargers are nice :P

-RM.

[Tj-zetec]

Originally Posted by photn

unfortunately unless you have an LR focus 02model that supercharger wont fit the LS.

Well, you could buy my LR as a project car. :

I've always wanted to SC it but couldn't justify those sorts of $$ on what was essentialy my daily driver.

[photn]

Originally Posted by Mullett

Eaton M90s are just what I've seen around, I don't know much about the M45, but as long as they flow well enough, should be fine. An Autorotor or Whipple twinscrew would be king, if you wanted to pay for it.

Cost varies wildly, based mainly on how much of the work you're going to do yourself, and how much you're going to pay someone to do. Depending on placements, you'd need to fabricate an intake manifold, which would be time consuming. A turbo is probably a simper proposition, but superchargers are nice :P

-RM.

An m45 flows nicely on 2ltr engine, but Jackson racing use an M90 on the SVT focus - alot more power and flows nicely!

whine isnt as loud as the m45 though.

[Mullett]

Yeah, the bigger SC will whine less, it's not working as hard :P I'm not sure where parasitic loss would make the bigger SC a better option, but it probably would have at least the same output across the rev range as the smaller one for the same boost level, maybe higher because of the extra flow. And unlike a bigger turbo, you don't have to worry about lag :P

-RM.

[DZFord]

Originally Posted by Fredo

Hey Mullett . . . why the Eaton M90 over the M45?

Any idea what sort of cost to expect when fitting a Supercharger?

$500,$1000, $2000?? Just ball park.

Would be noice . . . . big birthday coming up . . . . hmmm

Fredo

:

In the UK, you're looking at £3,000 + £400 fitting for a supercharger fitted to a duratec engine (in this case, the XR4): HERE

Or HERE is one for the LR engine, US$2,799 on sale!

Not a cheap exercise!

[Mullett]

yep, the cost difference between a job that you fabricate yourself using cheaply available components, and the cost of buying an aftermarket kit with new components is staggering. To be fair, the supercharger in that kit would be worth at least 1000 pounds, then there's all the hoses, the oil cooler that they throw in, R+D etc etc.

If i was going to supercharge (or turbo) my focus, and do ALL the fabrication work myself, I'd budget on about 2-2.5k for components and tuning, aside from the cost of the turbo/supercharger (because that can vary wildly)

-Injectors: $300
-Intercooler $300 (water/air)
-Silicon joins/piping components $200
-Misc pieces, oil pipes, etc $200-500
-Tuning $800-1200

Included in that, I'd have to machine all the flanges, cut, design and weld the manifolds and dump pipe (turbo) or brackets and pulleys (SC), re route water and oil hoses, etc etc. It's a fairly big job. I think I've decided not to go ahead with it...I'll just buy a WRX. Sure everyone's got one, but it's still a lot easier, and it's 4wd. And they've got a great interior, solid tuning base and good support.

WHY has there been this love of centrifugal superchargers lately? They work, they make good power, but they don't make torque. If you're going to use one, you're better with a turbo, the only advantage they have over a positive displacement supercharger is packaging. I might be missing something, but to me they seem to have all the downsides of a turbocharger without the mid-range torque and efficiency gains.

-RM.

[photn]

Originally Posted by Mullett

yep, the cost difference between a job that you fabricate yourself using cheaply available components, and the cost of buying an aftermarket kit with new components is staggering. To be fair, the supercharger in that kit would be worth at least 1000 pounds, then there's all the hoses, the oil cooler that they throw in, R+D etc etc.

If i was going to supercharge (or turbo) my focus, and do ALL the fabrication work myself, I'd budget on about 2-2.5k for components and tuning, aside from the cost of the turbo/supercharger (because that can vary wildly)

-Injectors: $300
-Intercooler $300 (water/air)
-Silicon joins/piping components $200
-Misc pieces, oil pipes, etc $200-500
-Tuning $800-1200

Included in that, I'd have to machine all the flanges, cut, design and weld the manifolds and dump pipe (turbo) or brackets and pulleys (SC), re route water and oil hoses, etc etc. It's a fairly big job. I think I've decided not to go ahead with it...I'll just buy a WRX. Sure everyone's got one, but it's still a lot easier, and it's 4wd. And they've got a great interior, solid tuning base and good support.

WHY has there been this love of centrifugal superchargers lately? They work, they make good power, but they don't make torque. If you're going to use one, you're better with a turbo, the only advantage they have over a positive displacement supercharger is packaging. I might be missing something, but to me they seem to have all the downsides of a turbocharger without the mid-range torque and efficiency gains.

-RM.

BUT THAT WHINE IS SOOOOOO INTOXICATING!!!!

[Fredo]

WHY has there been this love of centrifugal superchargers lately? They work, they make good power, but they don't make torque. If you're going to use one, you're better with a turbo, the only advantage they have over a positive displacement supercharger is packaging. I might be missing something, but to me they seem to have all the downsides of a turbocharger without the mid-range torque and efficiency gains.

-RM.[/QUOTE]

I'm generally a "Function over Form" kinda guy Mullett but I have to say a lot of the interest for me comes from the 'Cool Factor'.

Yeah, I know SC'ing has been around since the early 1920s but there is something sort of, grown up cool at about it I reckon.

Like . . if you see a go-fast Focus that sounds the business I expect it to be turbo'ed.

But if I got a look under the bonnet and there is a SC looking back at me I would think "hmmm . . . man, thats sweet".

Just my reckoning anyways . . .
Fredo
_2:

[DZFord]

Originally Posted by Mullett

I'll just buy a WRX. Sure everyone's got one, but it's still a lot easier, and it's 4wd. And they've got a great interior, solid tuning base and good support.

I like your thinking. Not to mention build quality as well!

[sumpPUMP]

Originally Posted by Mullett

I'll just buy a WRX. Sure everyone's got one, but it's still a lot easier, and it's 4wd. And they've got a great interior, solid tuning base and good support.

i actually thort about that too, good power/ good handling but, not so much wrx bcoz of price and popularity, but liberty for the all wheel drive handling. but opted for cheaper focus as you can see

[Mullett]

Originally Posted by Fredo

WHY has there been this love of centrifugal superchargers lately? They work, they make good power, but they don't make torque. If you're going to use one, you're better with a turbo, the only advantage they have over a positive displacement supercharger is packaging. I might be missing something, but to me they seem to have all the downsides of a turbocharger without the mid-range torque and efficiency gains.

-RM.

I'm generally a "Function over Form" kinda guy Mullett but I have to say a lot of the interest for me comes from the 'Cool Factor'.

Yeah, I know SC'ing has been around since the early 1920s but there is something sort of, grown up cool at about it I reckon.

Like . . if you see a go-fast Focus that sounds the business I expect it to be turbo'ed.

But if I got a look under the bonnet and there is a SC looking back at me I would think "hmmm . . . man, thats sweet".

Just my reckoning anyways . . .
Fredo
_2:[/QUOTE]

Yup, and I love the positive displacement superchargers for this reason...maybe you're right about the centrifugal ones...they just look cool :P

-RM.