Depression, Anxiety

[Geeseman]

I have read the book below recently and am now Re reading it noting issues that affect me. It deals with childhood abandonment, neglect and violence and the effects on our coping strategies as children which then become hindrances to our adult lives.
http://www.amazon.com/Complex-PTSD-S.../dp/B00HJBMDXK

[solarite_guy]

Originally Posted by Geeseman

It deals with childhood abandonment, neglect and violence and the effects on our coping strategies as children which then become hindrances to our adult lives.
http://www.amazon.com/Complex-PTSD-S.../dp/B00HJBMDXK

Interesting. My ex often thought I had a form of PTSD from my childhood. From the 1st grade to the end of 8th grade, the neighborhood we lived in was a very violent environment.

Funny, mum would tell me to ignore them. Yeah, right. Sorry mum.

I remember in 2nd grade coming upon a scene of one of my friends getting his head bashed with a rock and being told I would get the same the next day. A couple years later seeing the older brother of a good friend getting hit by a baseball bat in the back of the head. He never saw it coming. I was at least 100 yds away, but I know what I saw. He didn't die. But he never returned to school. Never left the house again.

Dad was a good athlete. Record holding mid-Atlantic weight lifter and accomplished amateur boxer. He taught us how to box. Very useful skill at the time.

When I learned the word "mutants" I applied it to these people. They were mean and vicious, but not nearly as physically tough. I had to finish my studies then help my dad lumberjacking even at a young age. I met friends on the other side of the neighbourhood. The Feuillet (fee-aye) family of French origin. They also had strong guidance to finish studies and help their dad with heavy physical work. There were a couple of other good families, The English and the Brookshires. The older English daughter saved my as from a sure *** kicking one time..another story. We were the island of normalcy.

Every day was an effort to either get yourself to school and back safely or get your friends to school and back safely.

Took me a long time to lower the guard a bit after that time. In all honesty, some of the inner aggression I developed helped me later in life, but I would never wish any of that on a child of mine.

[Geeseman]

Originally Posted by solarite_guy

Interesting. My ex often thought I had a form of PTSD from my childhood. From the 1st grade to the end of 8th grade, the neighborhood we lived in was a very violent environment.

Funny, mum would tell me to ignore them. Yeah, right. Sorry mum.

The book details that PTSD can occur from many different types of abuse. It can be directly violent of emotional abuse, right down to neglect.
One aspect that reinforces the PTSD is when your parents or carer or significant people in your life fail to allow you to vent anger, sadness, complains and grieve over 'events' that cause PTSD, like your violent encounters. Responses like 'ignore them' don't help and make it worse. My mother told me to just 'get over it'.
It doesnt cost anything to comfort a child who has experienced trauma. When the child doesn't deal with the emotions of abuse they form into depression later in life. I think if some people are depressed about life they need help to deal with things from their past they haven't grieved about or vented about and they need to do it with someone who cares about their experiences.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Geeseman

I think if some people are depressed about life they need help to deal with things from their past they haven't grieved about or vented about and they need to do it with someone who cares about their experiences.

Thats it in a nut shell with special consideration to the part in bold.

I think you will find this is the key to unlocking many people suffering depression, firstly admit you have a problem, identify the root causes from your life and most importantly, have someone who genuinely is interested in what you have/need to say, listen.
There is nothing more frustrating than ticking off the first two only to feel there is no one around you who is interested or has the time to listen and care.

My greatest dilemma was feeling the walls closing in on me and feeling alone because no one else noticed enough to enquire as to how i was travelling.
Communication is not one of my stronger qualities so i just let the frustration fester and before long i started to get desperate and thought of self harm to make people notice.

In hindsight, i dont blame the people around me, life is hectic and not everyone has the time to 'stop and smell the roses'. Truth is it was my own issues that were keeping me from reaching out and thankfully i made the connection before it was too late.

[solarite_guy]

Originally Posted by Geeseman

. My mother told me to just 'get over it'.
.

I absolutely hated the "ignore them" comment. It was an absolute, non-starter.

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by solarite_guy

Interesting. My ex often thought I had a form of PTSD from my childhood. From the 1st grade to the end of 8th grade, the neighborhood we lived in was a very violent environment.

Funny, mum would tell me to ignore them. Yeah, right. Sorry mum.

I remember in 2nd grade coming upon a scene of one of my friends getting his head bashed with a rock and being told I would get the same the next day. A couple years later seeing the older brother of a good friend getting hit by a baseball bat in the back of the head. He never saw it coming. I was at least 100 yds away, but I know what I saw. He didn't die. But he never returned to school. Never left the house again.

Dad was a good athlete. Record holding mid-Atlantic weight lifter and accomplished amateur boxer. He taught us how to box. Very useful skill at the time.

When I learned the word "mutants" I applied it to these people. They were mean and vicious, but not nearly as physically tough. I had to finish my studies then help my dad lumberjacking even at a young age. I met friends on the other side of the neighbourhood. The Feuillet (fee-aye) family of French origin. They also had strong guidance to finish studies and help their dad with heavy physical work. There were a couple of other good families, The English and the Brookshires. The older English daughter saved my as from a sure *** kicking one time..another story. We were the island of normalcy.

Every day was an effort to either get yourself to school and back safely or get your friends to school and back safely.

Took me a long time to lower the guard a bit after that time. In all honesty, some of the inner aggression I developed helped me later in life, but I would never wish any of that on a child of mine.

Just wondering.....was the violence you saw and suffered mostly in the neibourhood as such, or did it flow heavily into the school yard?

[solarite_guy]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

Just wondering.....was the violence you saw and suffered mostly in the neibourhood as such, or did it flow heavily into the school yard?

Absolutely, it was in the schools. ahhh, you give me a chance to talk about the older Ms English. So long ago. I think I recall her name as Judy. A couple years older than me and an absolute goddess. Long black hair, blue eyes, mini skirts, long legs and high heals. Keep that image.

Here is an example of why my ex thinks I have a form of childhood PTSD. Why should I remember so many details. It's almost like I relive it.

There was this one piece of crap who had to repeat who knows how many levels of education and would constantly go out of his way at the school bus stop or even on the bus, to humiliate, ridicule and terrorise anyone he wanted to. Just because he could. One day he starts smacking one of my friends in the head. My friend is sitting right next to me and this piece of crap reaches across and just starts smacking my friend in the head.

I threw a block to stop him. Got up and took a defensive position. I saw a twitch from his lat and knew a punch was coming my way. Threw another block and damn it, his hand came right inside my block and smacked me right upside the head. His mouth starts moving and a bunch of unintelligible words came out.

Right now I'm thinking "oh ****", this guy has a bad disposition, is twice my size, has me in his sites and knows what he is doing with the fists.

I go back to "oh ****" again, but damnit I'm going to make him pay for this win.

Out of the blue, here comes Judy, the goddess, and smacks him up side the head as hard as she could. Starts yelling at him, calling him all sorts of things and not to use this bus again. He didn't dare touch her. The whole bus load of students would have jumped him. Thank you Judy.

Crazy that such situations had to develop.

[superyob]

Is it possible to be depressed without knowing it? (General question, not related to myself...)

[russellw]

Originally Posted by superyob

Is it possible to be depressed without knowing it? (General question, not related to myself...)

Apparently so.

Cheers
Russ

[Ross 1]

Originally Posted by superyob

Is it possible to be depressed without knowing it? (General question, not related to myself...)

Yes it can, a lot of people don't realise it but they are masking their feelings with drinking, drugs, violence or general apathy to life. I only realised I was depressed etc when I self analysed as to why I was doing some of the above for no obvious reason. I was lucky and had a small epiphany which lead to counselling, it took me a while to break through all the macho crap and admit I was in counselling to my friends. I was surprised how many were also seeing a professional or asked me for their number. CS123 posted a very good article on the weekend re the amount of tradies who commit suicide, I have been a tradie for over 20 years now. I have seen many people on site seem perfectly normal and then not be there on Monday as they have ended their life. Countless others are drinking themselves numb or constantly high just to get through the night. The macho male attitude is slowly declining and it is no longer a problem to ask someone if they are ok. I have finally after all these years found a happy medium for work load. You are constantly stressed when you are really busy or don't know if the next contract is getting delayed. Not only do you have all your own bills and family to support, most of the guys that worked for me were the sole bread winners for their families. If you are worried about someone, talk to them or get them to talk to a doctor to find the next step. The worst feeling I have been left with was when a young guy, who seemed a little down nothing too major, finished work, drove home and shot himself. You spend a long time asking yourself what if I had just said something more.

[supershifty]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

Be careful as the mods made it clear to me this is off topic chat! Seems rather insensitive but hey...they're the boss

Off topic:

A moderators job is not an easy one - their calls are left up to their own discretion, they deal with crap all day. It's a voluntary position administered by broad thinking people, and frankly get no thanks for it.

You have a right of reply if you are not happy with the moderators decision of how they've edited/deleted/warned you. Firstly by PM to the moderator and discussion with him/her, and then if not satisfactory with the result you can contact the admin team (greens).

The admin team have the final say in all matters of resolution for a dispute, it has to end somewhere. This is the most well administered forum I've ever come across.

I'm not singling you out 1TUFFUTE, just using your post as an example, don't take it that I'm having a shot at you - that's not my intention.

Cheers!

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

Be careful as the mods made it clear to me this is off topic chat! Seems rather insensitive but hey...they're the boss

look m8 if you really need to know i reported your post - i didnt appreciate the graphic nature of it

now before you stamp out a post in response to my above - please dont (step back and have a little think on how your graphic post may have affected myself and others)

back OT

some great shares in here guys

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by superyob

Is it possible to be depressed without knowing it? (General question, not related to myself...)

It is the very reason that so many go undiagnosed, the fact that many dont know they are depressed.

I vivdly remember watching an episode of Beauty and the Beast with Stan Zemanek(sp) back in the 90's and he was very much against people being depressed to the point that he thought it was a weakness.
At the time i agreed with him completely and believed i would never suffer depression.

Fast forward 20 years and i found myself in a downward spiral that i didnt even recognise until it was too late, it wasnt until i began to consider suicide that i made an effort to firstly talk to my Wife, but more importantantly, seek help from my GP.

From a personal perspective i knew what a crap childhood i'd had, being an only child of my parents second marriages and hated by almost all of my half siblings because i reminded them of their parents marriage falling apart, i found it easy to talk about, desensitised to hate from your own flesh and blood before i was 5yo.
I didnt realise it had taken a toll on me until i hit rock bottom.

[Geeseman]

Originally Posted by superyob

Is it possible to be depressed without knowing it? (General question, not related to myself...)

Yeah it is. Depression doesn't mean you have to be an alcoholic or drug user either. You can just have an underlying feeling of sadness that won't go away. You don't want to deal with the feeling as it is scary and reminds you unconsciously of pain you felt as a child. You may try to keep busy to stop yourself from feeling that pain ( some medicate with drugs, alcohol, others eat, shop, buy stupid fast cars ), but it's always there like the child who just needs to cry and have someone tell him it's all ok.
Its funny how any men feel that crying is not cool or not manly or a sign of weakness. In fact it's a neccessary part of grieving. For some it's scary stuff because the feel if they start they won't stop.

[superyob]

Originally Posted by superyob

Is it possible to be depressed without knowing it? (General question, not related to myself...)

Thank you for your replies. I really did not expect the wealth of info offered up but it sure answered my question...

[BENT_8]

To be honest, discovering you have mental health issues is only half the battle, once diagnosed the true battle begins to first understand your weaknesses and to develop coping mechanisms to help combat them.
Thats the hurdle im facing now.

My biggest issues is my anger, not because i get violent, but because i have an almost zero tolerance to people who i percieve are trying to take advantage of me, its usually my mouth that does the damage.

Ever since i went through a terrible work cover experience i have struggled to maintain employment, not that i've ever been sacked, but because i end up blowing my stack over something i percieve as wrong.

I was driving trucks for 18 months, loving it as i love being behind the wheel. One of the other drivers pulled a swifty and i ended up getting a late run which caused me to be late for a family event, i blew my top and never went back.

Recently i was offered the job as greenkeeper at my club, i was in my element as i love being outdoors and love the game of bowls. I was two weeks into it when i locked horns with the president and it all went south.
They had renegged on part of the contract terms and i saw red, we had words and it was over in seconds.
A shame because in those two weeks the greens had never played better.

Truth is i knew it would happen, cant help myself, even warned my Wife that she needed to try and defuse me when things get heated, didnt make any difference, i am who i am and every day is a struggle to comprehend why i am the way i am.

If you knew me personally, and i do have a select few very close friends whom i've known for the best part of 30 years, you'd know that i am the type of person who can turn his hand to anything and that in itself is a tragedy because its not that i couldnt be anything i wanted to be, i just cant control my feelings when i feel wrong doneby.

I'd do anything for anyone, but if i feel you've disrespected me in the process, there is no turning back.

So what do i do with myself, well i look after my 4yo daughter, she gives me a reason to get up everyday. My Wife is my rock and because she earns enough to keep us comfortable i am no burden on the welfare system, i get nothing.
I completely redecorated the Club before Christmas, saved them thousands and then got burned for my troubles.

The house is immaculate, i even wash and chamois the gutters, eves and brickwork every few months, cant stand dust. Our cars are immaculate, the cleanest in the street. All my Wifes workmates are ****ed off because when they go home hubby is at work and the house is a mess, they have more disposable income, so its a trade off.
Im going through a ****fight over my Fathers estate, thats not easy.

Im trying to stay positive though, sharing my experiences helps, i feel like im doing something to help someone else, thats just me.

The funny part of it is that despite my anger issues im not violent, the old man was, i think he broke my spirit, his way of making you tough was to spar with me and land plenty but never let me reply, i'd just cower down as the jabs reigned down. He was an animal really.
In reality im probably a ticking timebomb.

Still, despite all that im hoping there's light at the end of the tunnel, and not an oncoming freight train...

To many what i share is very confronting and brutally honest, as i said in an earlier post, i have been desensitised to hatred and violence from an early age, i really dont give a **** what anyone thinks anymore, i am who i am.

[TheSneakiness]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

My biggest issues is my anger, not because i get violent, but because i have an almost zero tolerance to people who i percieve are trying to take advantage of me

This.

Add to this people who I know blatantly lie to me and then deny they are and **** me I blow my stack.

I did actually do this yesterday when I felt someone attacked me at work cause they wanted something (tone of the request) and I could have belted them. Lucky the new team leader is a better leader than the old one and was understanding of my position as he is going through a lot of garbage too.

I'm also doing a MSV course to help me understand why I might get violent and how to deter it.

[supershifty]

Originally Posted by superyob

Is it possible to be depressed without knowing it? (General question, not related to myself...)

In a word "yes" superyob.

I've always had anxiety from when I was in my teens, that's just the way I am. Accepted it and that was just from my insecurities - social acceptance etc - I think we all have that from time to time, just normal like everyone else. No biggie.

Depression was a different matter. I, as we all go through life changing events. Marriage fail/job loss/family issues/etc. Things mount up without within without realising the what it can cause in your mind.

I was a fairly resolute and positive thinking man. Self respect, a strong sense of family and work ethic. Lost it and started to wonder why.

After about 6 months of this I wrote down a list of my physical symptoms and took it to my Doc. Grinding teeth/unable to sleep/shatter vision/restlessness/low self esteem - the list goes on.

Doc said that I had depression after many questions. Wtf - me?

So, technically I didn't know I had depression superyob. There's many that don't. They just accept their lot.

I'm on medication for depression. Took a few different types before we found the "right" one. I'm pretty good now, just fall over every so often.

Thanks for asking mate.

Cheers!

Edit: My name is David.

[BLUEYBA]

Originally Posted by superyob

Is it possible to be depressed without knowing it? (General question, not related to myself...)

definitely. you don't actually see it in yourself and you blame others. the first part of getting well is first admitting that you have a problem and taking those first steps. Its very hard tho to make people recognise that they have it

[blackf6]

I died once. After a breakup with a girlfriend. Waking up not being able to breathe,with a balloon down my throat, getting my stomach pumped. Plus a killer migraine was enough to deter me. Life can be depressing at times. Work, work, work, sleep repeat.

[malazn mafia]

Originally Posted by blackf6

I died once. After a breakup with a girlfriend. Waking up not being able to breathe,with a balloon down my throat, getting my stomach pumped. Plus a killer migraine was enough to deter me. Life can be depressing at times. Work, work, work, sleep repeat.

Life has too many unanswered questions. It seems the only way to enjoy it is to live in the moment and not question anything. Is that how a 'normal' functioning human lives? Ignorance is bliss, but what happens when one is no longer content with living like this? Questions like: 'Why are we born ?' 'Did I have a choice to be born or not?' 'Why be happy if everything is temporal?' 'Why sleep if you have to wake up again?' 'Why eat if you will get hungry again?' 'If there is no birth, there is no death, so therefore being born is extremely cruel, so birth is a tragedy?' Once these thoughts bombard you long enough, waking up becomes a chore, eating becomes a chore, existing itself becomes a chore.. Everything grows meaningless, reality itself looks more and more like a big scam, a big illusion and so does 'happiness' or whatever that means. No amount of money, affection, material possessions can really create that mythical 'happiness'. So what is happiness? Being able to maintain a neutral balance of emotions? If one were constantly happy, wouldn't they then be insane ? So what is the opposite of depression, if one has most probably slipped into depression? Is it the care free , gullible mindset of a child which always hopes for the best, believes in 'forever' before all these concepts are dented, scratched and destroyed by the elements of this cruel existence ?

[Grega]

Is it possible to be depressed without knowing it? (General question, not related to myself...)

yes it is. because when you're there you don't realise the state as you're used to it.

[superyob]

Thank you David...

[olfella]

I read an article in Lancet way back in the 80's or 90's and the guts of it following a survey was GP's thought they could diagnose and treat depressive illnesses but in fact none of them had the time to spend with the patient. So rather that try treatments such as cognitive behaviour, REM etc they opt to dispense pills. Which raises the question that once diagnosed, who is the right professional to provide treatment?

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by olfella

I read an article in Lancet way back in the 80's or 90's and the guts of it following a survey was GP's thought they could diagnose and treat depressive illnesses but in fact none of them had the time to spend with the patient. So rather that try treatments such as cognitive behaviour, REM etc they opt to dispense pills. Which raises the question that once diagnosed, who is the right professional to provide treatment?

A mate I grew up with who was on meds for many many years has been through so many drug regimes it's not funny......he's extremely bad and this week started electro therapy which is actually quite scary! Failing that it's some type of invasive electrodes in his brain! Poor bloke that's for sure...

[olfella]

I think I can manage my depression but like a few on here now, it is the explosive reactions I have. I can control them to some extent by recognising the symptoms and removing myself from situations. Where I cannot do this is when all hell breaks out and it can go as fast as it arrives. I have no answers and nor does some of the professionals I have visited.

[supershifty]

Originally Posted by olfella

I think I can manage my depression but like a few on here now, it is the explosive reactions I have. I can control them to some extent by recognising the symptoms and removing myself from situations. Where I cannot do this is when all hell breaks out and it can go as fast as it arrives. I have no answers and nor does some of the professionals I have visited.

When I was going through puberty and into my mid 20's I had a very explosive temper, I mean very violent and would "snap" easily without warning. I was either calm as a church mouse or full on tilt, had no control whatsoever.

I'd "black out" and not remember a thing of what I had done while in a fit of rage. 9 times out of 10 I regretted my actions.

I'd think about my actions with much regret for what I had done. Guilt for what I did is/was a major contributing factor that I had to get my head around this temper.

It took a while to teach myself to calm down and walk away from the problem. Make a decision when you're rational. I've never regretted a decision I've made that way.

Takes some practice to take a few breaths and walk lads - totally worth it.

Cheers!

[Tui2]

I think my statement of assault charges due to me finally snapping at physical confrontation in my late teens, wasn't received or more to the truth, i didn't express my meaning correctly, it happened only twice, at 19 the first time, the second at 30, each time i was not the aggressor but was undisciplined and knew nothing of defence or fighting in anyway or form and went tasmanian devil on both occasions, horrified by the damage i caused i reported myself to be charged the second time,, my then brother in law who dropped the charges after the first court hearing, that he did not attend, came to my door step 4 months after the incident, on my bday with present in hand and my first look at his face since the fight, a shattered sickle shape replaced what was once a functioning nose on a once fairly handsome face. That sick feeling and reasoning as to why he never got it fixed in hospital, as he never said a word on that day, has been a constant reminder to avoid conflict. That is all i meant, I've never used my disorder as an excuse to be violent only as a cautionary explanation to please don't confront me for the sake of being a man with physical abuse, try intellectually putting me in my place and you'll get nothing but respect if i admittedly was out of line, otherwise call me out and i will now do as you do, hit soft, roll around, have laugh after being out of breath in 1 minute or walk away if you really want, but i will not go to gaol cause you can't handle alcohol,

[supershifty]

Originally Posted by supershifty

When I was going through puberty and into my mid 20's I had a very explosive temper, I mean very violent and would "snap" easily without warning. I was either calm as a church mouse or full on tilt, had no control whatsoever.

I'd "black out" and not remember a thing of what I had done while in a fit of rage. 9 times out of 10 I regretted my actions.

I'd think about my actions with much regret for what I had done. Guilt for what I did is/was a major contributing factor that I had to get my head around this temper.

It took a while to teach myself to calm down and walk away from the problem. Make a decision when you're rational. I've never regretted a decision I've made that way.

Takes some practice to take a few breaths and walk lads - totally worth it.

Cheers!

Upon reflection to the above post, I'll add to it.

When I was learning to calm the f down and chilling about my anger with people, I looked inside myself and asked myself this question: How did I contribute to this situation? It's all too easy to put the blame on someone else, it takes action and reaction. Not always the other persons fault.

You've got to be honest with yourself first guys. Part of my "tool" kit for dealing with crap.

I'm winning this battle, not over yet by a long mile.

Cheers!

[superyob]

Originally Posted by supershifty

You've got to be honest with yourself first


Cheers!

Aaaameeen!!! This applies in all aspects of life, whether suffering a condition or not. This is the number 1 way forward in anybody's journey through life...