Ford Announces New Engine Direction - Page 8

shepv8 · 18-07-2007, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lukep

v6 twin turbo (xr6)

Yeah, that sounds unbearable! Good enough reason as any not to buy a ford I guess!

ef_classic · 18-07-2007, 09:56 PM

I reckon this will make the EF-EL, AU, BA-BF series Falcons much more desirable because of there engines.

And if i had the money i would snap up a few XR6T Falcons, and do a GTHO type sale in 60 years time.

EDIT: probly no petrol in 60 years time!!!!

VeloXR6 · 18-07-2007, 09:58 PM

RIP I6 - I have loved you over the years ....... No matter what people say / expect / envisage, ... the I6 has been a great engine - I have owned 6 different models using this engine and love every single one...
This news brings a tear to my eye ..... maybe I will move to BMW ... A company that still cares about the good things in motoring over profitability.

VeloXR6 · 18-07-2007, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Dont forget the Commodore went from I6 to V6 without a name change or the world ending... and it didnt hurt them one bit.... even after adopting buicks rejected engine!

Thats becuase holden did not understand the I6 - the 250 crossflow was 100 times a better engine back then

asusdragon · 18-07-2007, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeloXR6

RIP I6 - I have loved you over the years ....... No matter what people say / expect / envisage, ... the I6 has been a great engine - I have owned 6 different models using this engine and love every single one...
This news brings a tear to my eye ..... maybe I will move to BMW ... A company that still cares about the good things in motoring over profitability.

im with you there mate it was the I6 that brought me the falcon and have owned 4 since then,

MITCHAY · 18-07-2007, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeloXR6

RIP I6 - I have loved you over the years ....... No matter what people say / expect / envisage, ... the I6 has been a great engine - I have owned 6 different models using this engine and love every single one...
This news brings a tear to my eye ..... maybe I will move to BMW ... A company that still cares about the good things in motoring over profitability.

Um that's the whole point of a company. To be profitable!

No point opening for business if you're only breaking even or worse, operating at a loss

:

shepv8 · 18-07-2007, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ef_classic

I reckon this will make the EF-EL, AU, BA-BF series Falcons much more desirable because of there engines.

And if i had the money i would snap up a few XR6T Falcons, and do a GTHO type sale in 60 years time.

EDIT: probly no petrol in 60 years time!!!!

You guys are speaking of the I6 like some holy relic. Its a good engine . Nothing more nothing less. Is it as good as other I6 motors in the world. I wouldnt go down that path unless you want to be embarresed. It has come to the end of its financial viability. Let it go and hope that its replacement does it justice

Dazza XLT · 18-07-2007, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

Um that's the whole point of a company. To be profitable!

No point opening for business if you're only breaking even or worse operating at a loss

:

Companies are not supposed to make profits!
They should just supply a product and run at a loss.

/End Sarcasm

If this is what needs to happen to ensure Ford's long term future in the Australian market, then so be it.

asusdragon · 18-07-2007, 10:06 PM

and what you think this engine change is going to make them more money, just off this forum there are a ppl already looking the other way and yes i know the general public what give a toss, but v6 engine aint really going to make anymore sales for ford either in the falcon, it will still be seen as a large 6, heavy fuel consumer another reason for name change

shepv8 · 18-07-2007, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeloXR6

RIP I6 - I have loved you over the years ....... No matter what people say / expect / envisage, ... the I6 has been a great engine - I have owned 6 different models using this engine and love every single one...
This news brings a tear to my eye ..... maybe I will move to BMW ... A company that still cares about the good things in motoring over profitability.

In case you havent heard the new BMW M3 is a V8. The I6 motor is dead.

VeloXR6 · 18-07-2007, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shepv8

In case you havent heard the new BMW M3 is a V8. The I6 motor is dead.

Yep and we have all been able to buy an M3 ......

mcflux · 18-07-2007, 10:10 PM

Will there be a surge in Epica sales due to this news?

70caprigt3k · 18-07-2007, 10:11 PM

There are obviously alot of people in here that have driven a proper Ford V6, The 3L Essex V6 was a fantastic engine that had loads of torque off idle and throughout the rev range and made an unbelieveable sound.

Don't get me wrong i love the Ford I6 and will be upset to see it go because it had alot to do with my love of cars and particularly Fords and what they have become today is nothing short of spectacular but the reality of the situation is that Ford Global are in a financial crisis and they are in serious need of a solution to pull themselves out of this rut and having a global platform may just do this.

As 4Vman has said on many occasions in this thread that its not the cylinder configuration that makes the engines power or torque so in reality it could be a V6, I6, W6 or even a Boxer 6 and Ford Australia could make a brilliant engine out of it and i know they will make an awsome engine out of the V6.

In the end i will always have a passion for Ford's and i will always admire and respect the heritage behind them which is what makes me a Ford supporter and i will never lose that just because they change the configuration of an engine, and quite simply if you don't want a V6 Falcon buy whatever the latest is at that time with the I6.

VeloXR6 · 18-07-2007, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

Um that's the whole point of a company. To be profitable!

No point opening for business if you're only breaking even or worse, operating at a loss

:

Fair enough ... but the Falcon 6 was always a better car because of the I ... to go V6, they may as well not bother .....

Holden have always made a better stock V8....

asusdragon · 18-07-2007, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeloXR6

Holden have always made a better stock V8....

not sure bout that 351 mmmmmmmmm
for there time that were a pretty good engine

madmelon · 18-07-2007, 10:14 PM

I'd like to make several points on this topic...

The Duratec 2.1L and 3L engines found in the Jag X-Type (also S-Type, etc) are unbelieveably smooth. On the test drives a family member and myself had, we couldn't feel when the engine was running, when it was started and when it was stopped. The Falcon 6 is SEVERELY behind in this area, even in BF trim.

When pushed, even the 2.1 had an absolutely glorious note. Refer to the following youtube links. This pretty much has everything to do with extractor and muffler (and obviously cam timing) selection and nothing to do with V or Inline.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIUvZZnANlU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Byp-B5C8Feo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdMStE3CHWk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mb7Q4D3rJyw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLiE-hNhL08
Most of these don't do it justice.

A V or Inline configuration generally doesn't determine "Torquiness". What does is the piston stroke, cam profiles and (believe it or not) inlet manifold design plays a huge part. The Cyclone currently has a single stage manifold but according to most articles, a dual stage (like EL -> current Falcon and most other engines now) is possible/in development. Remember how the Gen 3 was bagged (originally) for being gutless at low revs? It has a much longer stroke than the old "5.0HO" and an extra 800cc. It's just a matter of how you set it up. Fortunately, it's becoming more and more possible to have the best of both worlds- good torque at low and high rpm- with emerging technologies.

The lighter weight of the alloy block, along with the lower centre of gravity and less length (due to the V...) should bring about some interesting advances with handling, straight line performance, economy and aerodynamics- The bonnet line can be much lower if it doesn't have to accomodate the length of an Inline 6 engine.

I'm a big fan of the I6 architecture for various engineering reasons but at this point, I'm sorry to say, the Cyclone engine is a long way ahead in every department except torque. Tough luck.

I do feel for the 600 people getting "shafted" by this decision, but at least they have been given notice and can be retrained or choose to find another job. I don't think anyone will forget that Ford Aus has stood on THEIR shoulders for many years.

I also feel for the 50,000 Ford US employees who are being REMOVED over the coming months and years...and the 30,000 GM employees...and the (other large number) going at Chrysler. Thinking about it like this might be helpful- the loss of their jobs will probably ensure the continued employment of many many thousands more worldwide.

XAGSV8 · 18-07-2007, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darran

If this is what needs to happen to ensure Ford's long term future in the Australian market, then so be it.

Damn right, it better then losing the Falcon and being handed a Taurus as a replacement. The I6 is a good engine and it is a pity it is going but the problem here is people are scared of the unknown. Once the V6 comes along everybody will wonder what the fuss was all about.

gazza750 · 18-07-2007, 10:23 PM

it was the same hoo haaa when gm went from the inline 6 to the v configuration

asusdragon · 18-07-2007, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gazza750

it was the same hoo haaa when gm went from the inline 6 to the v configuration

yeah and look what that got them a buick v6

shepv8 · 18-07-2007, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XAGSV8

Damn right, it better then losing the Falcon and being handed a Taurus as a replacement. The I6 is a good engine and it is a pity it is going but the problem here is people are scared of the unknown. Once the V6 comes along everybody will wonder what the fuss was all about.

Damn right again.

I wonder though, of all the people saying " stuff it, Im not going to buy a falcon now", how many of them are genuine buyers anyway. If this was all it took to turn them away they werent really falcon fans in the first place.
Jumping ship because I6 is changing to V6. You've got to be kidding.
Sounds like you guys were looking for an excuse not to buy a falcon.

4vxc · 18-07-2007, 10:26 PM

I think its about time they got rid of the old work horse. I just don't see how people can really think its such a great engine that could never be replaced. It only really rose to fame due to the XR6T, the normally aspirated ones are nothing special.If you really love inline 6cyl engines then you have probably driven a BMW inline 6, the two cant be compared in any way at all to me. If its torque and performance you want surely you would by a V8 Falcon anyway? I'm sure the V6 won't harm sales at all and will be well sorted to please traditional Falcon buyers before release.

mcflux · 18-07-2007, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asus_dragonorb

yeah and look what that got them a buick v6

sales?

VeloXR6 · 18-07-2007, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asus_dragonorb

yeah and look what that got them a buick v6

LOL..... Yep ... American engines... its what we all need.

Sorry to say I6 made me a ford man.... removal of it will make me a european car man ....

I will still support Craig and the boys, but I will not buy whatever american that ford try to replace the I6 with .......

shepv8 · 18-07-2007, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asus_dragonorb

yeah and look what that got them a buick v6

So was a buick V6 better than going belly up for Holden?
This isnt about what engine we prefer. Its about the ford brand still existing in 10 years time. There are bigger issues here than people crying because their favourite engine is being replaced with an, albeit unproven, better one.

asusdragon · 18-07-2007, 10:30 PM

hold on another great aussie icon gone, seems like everything else aussie too doesnt

VeloXR6 · 18-07-2007, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asus_dragonorb

hold on another great aussie icon gone, seems like everything else aussie too doesnt

Well said .... at some stage prople have to say F... profits ... wwhat about the things we like and love ?

Perana · 18-07-2007, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeloXR6

LOL..... Yep ... American engines... its what we all need.

Sorry to say I6 made me a ford man.... removal of it will make me a european car man ....

I will still support Craig and the boys, but I will not buy whatever american that ford try to replace the I6 with .......

The Duratec was actually designed in Europe.. so apart from being assembled in the US its more Euro than anything.. Co-incidentally it was initially designed by those crazy people at Porsche... also with input from another company you may have heard of... Cosworth ring any bells?

There is NO WAY you can even dare to compare it to the Buick V6

VeloXR6 · 18-07-2007, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeloXR6

Well said .... at some stage prople have to say F... profits ... wwhat about the things we like and love ?

ssorry aboth the ddyslexia

bodes-sh · 18-07-2007, 10:34 PM

so why don't all the people that won't buy a ford v6 get together and start up an engine building factory, then when the new falcon is made, you can sell ford the I6 engines you have built, to help them not go out of business because they can't afford to build it themselves......either that or get the 600 engine builders to do it for you and then pay them, all the while building an engine with no car to put it in

asusdragon · 18-07-2007, 10:34 PM

yeah that cos all america can design is more cube