Nuclear power - do we need it?

[4.9 EF Futura]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

With the news now emerging that the Government tried to cover up the recent gas leak at Lucas Heights, we should ask ourselves, can we trust the Government? (any Government) to run such a dangerous buisness as nuclear power.

The Government has expressed no interest in supplying nuclear power generated electricity. It would be provided by the private sector.

So the question which comes to bear... can we trust a pofit-focused entity to run such a dangerous business as nuclear power?

[mik]

at a guess that would be no and no.

[charles_wif_xf]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

I'm no big city economist but im fairly confident you cant "create" money at your own whim. i.e.

Govt: "we need to print twice as much money to pay for this wind farm"
Wind farm supplier: "well then consider the price doubled"

A $100 note doesnt mean its worth $100. It's worth whatever amount of "x" you can swap for the $100 note...

The government here prints money on demand and has done so for many decades. In the US, it has happened for almost 100 years. They don't go about advertising that the printing presses are running 24/7/365.24. But that is going off topic.

[Outbackjack]

I am not sure that we should go down the nuclear path. But there sure are a lot of stories coming out at the moment about leaks and cover ups. I wonder if someone in the "press" is pushing a borrow here.

[Miss_XR6]

Originally Posted by charles_wif_xf

The government here prints money on demand and has done so for many decades. In the US, it has happened for almost 100 years. They don't go about advertising that the printing presses are running 24/7/365.24. But that is going off topic.

you are correct they sometimes print money 24/7 in australia

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by Miss_XR6

you are correct they sometimes print money 24/7 in australia

Dont read too much into this. Lots of money printed is to replace old notes/coins. Mind you, I wish I owned one of them money machines!!

[red_hotxr6]

I heard this morning on the news that their were 4 separate incidents in the last week involving nuclear material here in australia. Only caught part of it any body hear anything.

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by red_hotxr6

I heard this morning on the news that their were 4 separate incidents in the last week involving nuclear material here in australia. Only caught part of it any body hear anything.

Yeah, that is what I was refering to. www.news.com.au has some stories on it. Just seems a little coincidental (SP?).

[red_hotxr6]

HA HA good one at least we are on the same wave length.

[Falcon Freak]

This is a MUST visit website about Chernobyl

FF

[charles_wif_xf]

Originally Posted by red_hotxr6

I heard this morning on the news that their were 4 separate incidents in the last week involving nuclear material here in australia. Only caught part of it any body hear anything.

Incidents like this happen every week. It's just the media deciding to shed some light now due to the debate about nuclear power heating up.

[red_hotxr6]

You would think this particular area would be run like a well oiled machined, instead off people making mistakes.

[AUIIIXR8]

Super site on chernobyl there mate. It took a while but i've gone right through it except the 9 part vids at the end.


Very interesting take on it all.

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by charles_wif_xf

Incidents like this happen every week. It's just the media deciding to shed some light now due to the debate about nuclear power heating up.

Was the pun intended?? :voldar02:

[Falcon Freak]

Originally Posted by AU2XLSV8

Super site on chernobyl there mate. It took a while but i've gone right through it except the 9 part vids at the end.


Very interesting take on it all.

What grabbed my attention was that the Soviet authorities demolished a number of the evacuated villages. Nobody can prove how many people were affected by this disaster if one can't prove how many people actually lived in that area before 26 April 1986. Typical communist tactic - hide the truth from the people.

FF

[charles_wif_xf]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

Was the pun intended?? :voldar02:

No it wasn't Outback, I just noticed it when I read your post with the relevant bit in red!!!

[4.9 EF Futura]

Originally Posted by charles_wif_xf

The government here prints money on demand and has done so for many decades. In the US, it has happened for almost 100 years. They don't go about advertising that the printing presses are running 24/7/365.24. But that is going off topic.

Printing money is fine. Remember - the money is worth very little, it's the face value that makes it worth anything. Printing money is fine when there is underlying economic growth which necessitates it.

A bank is a good example. Let's say the NAB finishes its year end accounts and books a profit to the balance sheet. In doing so - money is being "created".. i.e. they've taken 100 bucks and turned it into 110 bucks. But the transaction is just a bunch of numbers ina computer database.

So yeah... they print money on demand. Demand for cash. Demand for notes and coins. Demand for money is a different concept. You cant generate money on a machine - only the bits of metal and plastic which represent money. Very different concept.

You can just print a few billion dollars to pay for a power station. You need to HAVE that money in the first place - then you print the notes required to represent it... but im pretty sure paying someone to build a power plant would be done electronically

[Bill M]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

With the news now emerging that the Government tried to cover up the recent gas leak at Lucas Heights, we should ask ourselves, can we trust the Government? (any Government) to run such a dangerous buisness as nuclear power.

SPOT ON. Who can guarentee 100% compliance with safety regulations in a nuclear power station? Who can guarentee no shortcuts in engineering design by private companies? Who can guarentee 100% upkeep of staff training and maintenance of nuclear facilities? What only the Russians have human error? Three Mile Island anyone? There will always be accidents no matter how sophisticated we think we are its just a matter of how much you pay for those accidents,not as in $$$.
cheers
Bill.

[charles_wif_xf]

I saw a doco on Chernobyl during the course of the weekend and what I saw startled me. Conservative guesstimates have placed the death toll at Chernobyl at 500,000 souls. It cost the Soviet government 18 billion roubles (in 1986 that was US$18 billion) to clean up as much as they have up until now. The cleaning crews were 20 seconds or so away from Chernobyl going critical and triggering a nuclear explosion which would have wiped off half of Europe. And turdbrick Howard wants to bring this threat to our doorstep. Not whilst there is a heart beating in this little black duck's chest.

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by charles_wif_xf

I saw a doco on Chernobyl during the course of the weekend and what I saw startled me. Conservative guesstimates have placed the death toll at Chernobyl at 500,000 souls. It cost the Soviet government 18 billion roubles (in 1986 that was US$18 billion) to clean up as much as they have up until now. The cleaning crews were 20 seconds or so away from Chernobyl going critical and triggering a nuclear explosion which would have wiped off half of Europe. And turdbrick Howard wants to bring this threat to our doorstep. Not whilst there is a heart beating in this little black duck's chest.

after reading your post i think id rather have my own wind fan and generator in my back yard . one or 2 in every suburb wouldnt go astray though either . or solar power on every house .

[TassieF6]

A safer and more enviromentally friendly alternative that has been
proposed is the use of Thorium as a fuel instead of Uranium.
Thoriums radioactive waste life is only 500yrs as compared to Uraniums
waste life of 10's of thousands of years, as well, accidents like Chernobyl
are impossible with Thorium. There is also no by product like Plutonium as there is with Uranium. In fact a Thorium reactor can be used to burn a quantity of weapons grade Plutonium and many other nuclear wastes.
The added bonus is that Australia has the largest supply of Thorium in the world and finally Thorium doesn't need to be enriched like Uranium which is an energy & resourse intensive process, so would therefore be a cheaper cost alternative as well. Food for thought anyway.

[charles_wif_xf]

Originally Posted by tassiexr8

A safer and more enviromentally friendly alternative that has been
proposed is the use of Thorium as a fuel instead of Uranium.
Thoriums radioactive waste life is only 500yrs as compared to Uraniums
waste life of 10's of thousands of years, as well, accidents like Chernobyl
are impossible with Thorium. There is also no by product like Plutonium as there is with Uranium. In fact a Thorium reactor can be used to burn a quantity of weapons grade Plutonium and many other nuclear wastes.
The added bonus is that Australia has the largest supply of Thorium in the world and finally Thorium doesn't need to be enriched like Uranium which is an energy & resourse intensive process, so would therefore be a cheaper cost alternative as well. Food for thought anyway.

To correct you on some terms you use. The correct term is half life, not the waste life.

For the boffns to sign off on thorium as a fuel, many years of research will be needed before any sort of consensus is reached.

Whilst thorium doesn't need to be enriched, it still needs refinement from the ore state it is found in and that is still an energy intensive process

[TassieF6]

Cosmosmagazine Thorium reactors is a good read on the two thoughts for thorium reactors. India is also moving fast in developing thorium reactors as well seeing as they have the second biggest supply. It would be a pity if Australia got left out seeing as nuclear energy is so high on our agenda.

[XR Martin]

If you understand the design of Chernobyl you would realise what happened there wouldnt be possible in a modern western Nuclear power station. Its like comparing a Lada to a Merc, because Lada is **** that makes all cars ****? No of course not.

[Stugots]

Yes for nuclear energy with nuclear weapon producing capabilities.

[Outbackjack]

Here is an open question to anybody that wants to give an answer..... Where will the waste be dumped/stored?? In the sates that beneifit from the power stations, or ship it ""outback" where nobody cares about????

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

Here is an open question to anybody that wants to give an answer..... Where will the waste be dumped/stored?? In the sates that beneifit from the power stations, or ship it ""outback" where nobody cares about????

Plenty of open space near Pine Gap going to waste :

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by GasOLane

Plenty of open space near Pine Gap going to waste :

Not true. PG covers a large area and is very close to Alice.

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

Not true. PG covers a large area and is very close to Alice.

Uh, that was sarcasm Jack, meaning that all those seppos are a waste of space

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by GasOLane

Uh, that was sarcasm Jack, meaning that all those seppos are a waste of space

I didn't take offence....... But, I work with those seppo's. And they nothing like a waist of space....... Cheers.