Mitsubshi is about to shut shop. - Page 4

Walkinshaw · 06-02-2008, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Rear wheel drive for the 380 would probably have saved them....

Agreed. If The TJ/380 was RWD i know I'd have looked very seriously at them.

Richmalbill · 06-02-2008, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kia Chaser

Wasn't that because the Falcon sales FELL... just because one product total falls, doesn't mean the other ones actually gain.

Bah - I think most people were expecting a the Mitsu plant closure...

Do Mitsu have any OZ building plans?

Read the post...Aurion sale ROSE....IE They sold more of them in January than they sold last January. In a context where every other manuafacturer sold significantly less vehicles than in the year before, Toyota sold significantly MORE.

Richmalbill · 06-02-2008, 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

They never managed to shed the image of a sensible car, made for geriatrics = straw hat or bowls hat at the rear window. The Magna also entrenched itself as the company car for lower order executives.

If they wanted to make a family car they should have targetted the family man with kids. It might have played in their favour if they actually increased the price to eliminate the perception that the cost gap between it and a similarly appointed VE was because of inferior quality rather than value for money.

.

I don't neccessarily agree with you here...and I'll tell you why. In shedding the sensible car image they were left without a niche. They tried to position the vehicle to compete with Holdens and Falcons, but people who bought a Falcon or Commodore naturally had no particular inclination to change brands because they are happy with their choice and meanwhile they alienated their existing customers.

I was in the interesting position to be intimatedly involved with the development of the 380 (or PS41 as we knew it then), I actually designed some of the external parts.

At the time I recall that many at MMAL felt and expressed (a quite remarkable display of the lack of faith they felt for the direction of the company) that it would be prudent to somehow fundementally differentiate the vehicle from the rest of the market - two of the more common themes were that it should be a Diesel or a hatchback (or both!).

As it turned out either of these features would have been a masterstroke - but I guess being right will be of little comfort as those same engineers collect their dole cheque!

Richmalbill · 06-02-2008, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrEL

Maybe Tonsley Park is just doomed for manufacturing cars. First it was British Leyland(BMC) that went ,then Chrysler now Mitsubishi.

Don't think BMC ever made cars there! They were made at Zetland in Sydney which was also known as Victoria Park. BMC also had plants in Melbourne but never in Adelaide.

SPK-250 · 06-02-2008, 02:14 AM

My first job was at that plant on the seat line.

I actually took a redundancy from there back in 1999 after only 2 years and that was the first offerings of them. It just snowballed from there. A couple of mates who alsio worked there got a couple more years out of them, but it seems as though they knew they were going south even back then.

SB076 · 06-02-2008, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steffo

Actually, it would probably improve exponentially.

What are you basing that on? Have you driven a Russian made car? The 380 was a qualtiy product that was put together by skilled workers. Unfortunately as others have said it was the wrong car for Australia.

Wally · 06-02-2008, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richmalbill

I don't neccessarily agree with you here...and I'll tell you why. In shedding the sensible car image they were left without a niche. ....

And niches are supposed to be higher profit, lower volume. They got one part of the equation right.

It was almost like a 180° change in marketing tactics, coming from a high volume leader like the Sigma to a low volume loss leader like the 380.

troppo · 06-02-2008, 10:10 AM

I feel sorry for the employees and the residents of SA who, no that long ago, were forced to dip into their own pockets to bail out Mitsubishi. I said then it was only postponing the inevitable and a complete waste of money. The 380 was always going to be too little, too late.

Ralliart · 06-02-2008, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Werd.

You own one, and your bias is extremely obvious.

um no not because i drive a tj but because they look good through out the whole range of the 3rd Generation Magna Range plus the The TJ has the Ralliart plus the vrx in their range,

btw i have driven a 380 off one of my friends it felt so weird because it was big , as i have said in my earlier posts i would not buy a 380, i would buy a xr8/ve over the 380

hy_boi · 06-02-2008, 10:44 AM

I've drove all of the big 4 cars, some on a daily basis, and IMO the 380 for what is it didn't handel like a boat like the other 3.

In terms of handling, going to my XR6T was a step backwards in the handling deparment.

Homer1 · 06-02-2008, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gngtho

Appart from all the prev history of Mitsi's problems, deos anyone know if other pollitical issuss have impacted on the Japs decission. IE: the fact that so many Aussies are against the killing of the whales by them.

I think to some extent this is one other pollitical issue in this.

You gotta be kidding!!! Its a decision based purely on business sense. The plant is operating at 1/3 capacity and losing money big time. Any company, whatever nationality or political issues would have closed the plant, end of story!

:

**Polyal** · 06-02-2008, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Homer1

You gotta be kidding!!! Its a decision based purely on business sense. The plant is operating at 1/3 capacity and losing money big time. Any company, whatever nationality or political issues would have closed the plant, end of story!

:

Yeap, surely the employees knew this was coming.

It doesn't help, but its been crap there for the past 2-3 years atleast. People need to realise that Oz is a small market. You cant continuely develop and build cars here that sell so little; you need to either export, or only do the R&D here.

Vines5161 · 06-02-2008, 11:42 AM

What we (South Australia and Australia) now need to do, is to get behind the workers and assist them in getting their future back together. We need to bring manufacturing companies to SA because that is the skills that most of the workers have and Tonsley Park would be a great piece of land to do that on. Just gut the sheds and inplant new machinery.

The government has said today that they will be requiring MMAL to repay the $35mill that was given to them in the last bail out, because MMAL have not kept their end of the deal. That was to stay open until the end of 2010 and employ 300 engineers in RandD.

Some workers have said that they were in the process of looking towards their future, knowing that at the end of 2010 they would be out of a job. But now all those plans have been thrown into disarray.

We know workers there and are feeling very bad for them at the moment.

Let's get behind the workers and their families!

autolover08 · 06-02-2008, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hy_boi

I've drove all of the big 4 cars, some on a daily basis, and IMO the 380 for what is it didn't handel like a boat like the other 3.

In terms of handling, going to my XR6T was a step backwards in the handling deparment.

Interesting...i guess it can depend if you prefer FWD handling dynamics over RWD dynamics.
I've driven all of them myself as like you i work in the auto trade.
Not long ago i drove an aurion back to back with a NA BF XR6, the aurion impressed with power and NVH but in no way could i handle the FWD steering feel on a day to day basis compared to the more precise steering feel of the BF XR6.
The aurions steering feel simply felt unsettled due to the amount of power being feed through the front wheels, also taking into account Toyota isn't the best at making a car handle accurately.
I would easily take a 380 anyday over the aurion for driving enjoyment, i was trying to find a 380 as my drive car only the other day!
To me the 380 and Bf falcons feel line ball, FWD and RWD only separating them for fundamental dynamic differences.

autolover08 · 06-02-2008, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gngtho

Appart from all the prev history of Mitsi's problems, deos anyone know if other pollitical issuss have impacted on the Japs decission. IE: the fact that so many Aussies are against the killing of the whales by them.

I think to some extent this is one other pollitical issue in this.

vztrt · 06-02-2008, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Correct, in fact from a couple of whispers im hearing it maybe costing them money...

Wouldn't surprise me with the dollar at 90c US there isn't much play. I would love to see Holden and Toyota's profit figures at the end of the financial yr.

4Vman · 06-02-2008, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

Wouldn't surprise me with the dollar at 90c US there isn't much play. I would love to see Holden and Toyota's profit figures at the end of the financial yr.

Yes.. allot of deals were done when the dollar was around 70c US too..
Last i heard Holden were re-evaluating their export program, and the only thing off-setting some of the pain was gains made from the exchange rate on importing, especially from the export buyer, i.e in Holdens case engines etc..

Fairlane · 06-02-2008, 09:03 PM

Interesting article on carsales at the moment and it confirms what i always believed

http://editorial.carsales.com.au/car...w/2888751.aspx

Quote:

It was reported around the time that the 380 was launched in 2005, that MMAL had earlier mounted a strong business case to assume the responsibility for RHD production of the Chrysler 300C and -- with the remaining capacity -- build a new large car based on the outgoing W210 Mercedes-Benz E-Class platform.

Since the 300C shares some of its underpinnings with the W210 Merc, the production line could have been profitable and efficient, but according to insiders, there was a cultural gulf between the Japanese, the Germans and the Americans -- with Mitsubishi's Australian operation caught in the centre.

Dave_au · 06-02-2008, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

rubbish... camry is a mid sized car with a large fleet fan base....

Likewise Ford and Holden (except the mid sized car part)

Steffo · 07-02-2008, 03:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SB076

What are you basing that on? Have you driven a Russian made car? The 380 was a qualtiy product that was put together by skilled workers. Unfortunately as others have said it was the wrong car for Australia.

Yes I have. My family is also from a part of Europe where Russian cars flood the roads with abundance. Whilst being slow, horribly bad dynamically, no handling, crap drivers cars with little to no interior features... they do not stop going. Rain, shine, hail, snow... whatever... they go. On whatever terrain.

SB076 · 07-02-2008, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steffo

Yes I have. My family is also from a part of Europe where Russian cars flood the roads with abundance. Whilst being slow, horribly bad dynamically, no handling, crap drivers cars with little to no interior features... they do not stop going. Rain, shine, hail, snow... whatever... they go. On whatever terrain.

I dont doubt they keep going its getting them to stop thats the problem

But you cant compare a typical russian car with a 380, sure the russian car meets its customer specifications however, the 380 is highly advanced with far more gadgets that mean more things can go wrong. I also think the quality of the 380 was quite good,

Steffo · 07-02-2008, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SB076

I dont doubt they keep going its getting them to stop thats the problem

But you cant compare a typical russian car with a 380, sure the russian car meets its customer specifications however, the 380 is highly advanced with far more gadgets that mean more things can go wrong. I also think the quality of the 380 was quite good,

New Russian cars actually do have all the gadgets and things in them. The point was, their cars are bulletproof reliable. They're just not something a car enthusiast would ever want to own.

Dave_au · 07-02-2008, 05:32 PM

I thought Lada's had a bad reputation for reliability. Thats what one of my mates mates said who had one. And I read it in a magazine so it must be true.

4Vman · 07-02-2008, 05:38 PM

Just google it, that's where most "facts" come from....

Sourbastard · 07-02-2008, 06:06 PM

This was the last Mitsubishi made vehicle to visit our shores that wasn't crap.

A shame about the job losses, but hopefully the state government and other local fleet purchasers will reallocate their fleet purchasing to Holdens and encourage some more jobs growth there.

nugget378 · 07-02-2008, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sourbastard

This was the last Mitsubishi made vehicle to visit our shores that wasn't crap.

I bet you could round up a whole mess of whales with that...

staids · 07-02-2008, 06:15 PM

Nothing wrong with the EVO mate! Damn shame though!
i understand your anger at the whaling! i'm angry too! staids

Sourbastard · 07-02-2008, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staids

Nothing wrong with the EVO mate!

The wings are too short for sustained flight.

fmc351 · 07-02-2008, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sourbastard

The wings are too short for sustained flight.

By the looks of the tailpipe, its still running albeit a tad out of tune.

Nikked · 08-02-2008, 03:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

rubbish... camry is a mid sized car with a large fleet fan base....

Steffo sorta has a point, the camry is a large enough car to steal sales from ford/holden, it does have compareable room inside, but has more economical engine options. Plus some people wont care about RWD drive as it not like your going to be driving fast enough to understand the limits of FWD, and the camry is capable of pulling caravans. If they are worried about the towing capacity, then they go elswhere, and then they look at patrols and Land Cruseies...and its not like toyota is not the only company with a large fleet fan base fan base. There is a reason why FWD cars are making inroads...