mini-spool led to car crash which killed the driver's son - Page 2

blueoval · 31-07-2014, 06:49 PM

Based on my understanding from mates who have explained it to me and had a Detroit Lockers fitted to their race cars:

A Detroit Locker is a more heavy duty version of a LSD. Except there are no clutch packs in a Detroit Locker as it's based on solid spool technology. When the locker engages under load, it locks into the spool. Operates just like a mini spool except stronger. When the is no load, the locker releases from the spool and acts like an open wheeler to gain control around corners and turns etc.

Also read here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locking_differential

Anyone else who knows more about them, feel free to correct my terminology.

STINKY NINJA · 31-07-2014, 06:53 PM

A mini spool replaces the spider gears in a diff centre and gives direct drive to both axles %100 of the time.
It will also cause bad understeer which is not good... as for losing control that comes down to a crap driver, if something goes wrong lift off the power,simple.

Road Games · 31-07-2014, 07:13 PM

Wow how did i make it all the way down to kilmore and back thru 10hrs of rain no less and lots of twisties yet my rear never stepped out on me ??

Coincidently my spool is being removed tomorrow....

ratter · 31-07-2014, 07:46 PM

nothing is a strong as locking both axles together as a spool or mini spool does, argue as much as you want but they affect the way a car behaves and turns and yes can be influenced on driver behaviour or skill, they belong on a race track

steve.zissou · 01-08-2014, 02:08 PM

but this accident had nothing to do with a mini spool.

Guy did a big fishtail and lost it at the end.

SO the guy probably had 2 options (probably advised by his legal council).

option 1) I am an idiot for doing that in the wrong place and with my kid in the car, had an accident and killed my son.

option 2) You'r honour, I installed this new car part that locked the rear wheels and unbeknownst to me, when i accelerated it suddenly started spinning and caused me to loose control and crash into a tree.

Judge with no car knowledge: ok, your still guilty but there is mitigating circumstances

Judge with car knowledge: Your a f'wit. I know why you put a spool in (to do skids easier/better). If any thing a spool makes a car more predictable while doing skids. You obviously knew what you were doing because you kept doing the skid for 30m. Doing the skid at high speed and then loosing control is what caused the accident.

If it wasn't his car, he didnt know it had a spool and it was wet and he was driving around a corner - 100% would have been the spools fault (well, the guy who put it in and then let him drive it.

jpblue1000 · 01-08-2014, 02:38 PM

difference in pictures between spool types.
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=m...w=1692&bih=697
Small sphere is min spool and fits in existing differential replacing planetary gears.
flanged shaft is a Full spool which replaces entire geared section and carrier and has crown wheel bolted to it and axles inserted.

Both Lock each axle to one another preventing differential action left to right.
They belong on race cars only...

JP

mik · 01-08-2014, 04:16 PM

That old saying, you play you pay.

STINKY NINJA · 01-08-2014, 04:35 PM

"Dads car upgrade killed son" more like "idiotic father killed son with a show of 0 carefactor and irresponsibility/stupidity",hes gonna feel this for the rest of his stupid life.
Accidents very seldom happen,stupidity,inexperience,lack of attention etc are the cause of the majority.
Rest in peace to the poor kid,nobody deserves to go out like that.

poppa smurf · 01-08-2014, 04:56 PM

but but but.......everybody said burnouts were "safe" and that their little kiddie goes "wheeeeeee" whenever he does one and that "it's just a little skid!"

how can this be.......I'm so confused.

burnz · 01-08-2014, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poppa smurf

but but but.......everybody said burnouts were "safe" and that their little kiddie goes "wheeeeeee" whenever he does one and that "it's just a little skid!"

how can this be.......I'm so confused.

Quote:

Originally Posted by STINKY NINJA

"Dads car upgrade killed son" more like "idiotic father killed son with a show of 0 carefactor and irresponsibility/stupidity",hes gonna feel this for the rest of his stupid life.
Accidents very seldom happen,stupidity,inexperience,lack of attention etc are the cause of the majority.
Rest in peace to the poor kid,nobody deserves to go out like that.

you blokes have no idea!!!

the car will always want to go left, due to camber of the road.

gas it on anything but a drag strip/raceway. your going for a power pole (left) due to the camber.

pottery beige · 01-08-2014, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poppa smurf

but but but.......everybody said burnouts were "safe" and that their little kiddie goes "wheeeeeee" whenever he does one and that "it's just a little skid!"

how can this be.......I'm so confused.

Have you ever dropped a skid or just preying on aca hysteria

pottery beige · 01-08-2014, 07:57 PM

Big difference between someone giving it a tap and some hektick **** wit with yo mini spool and stocky rims chucking it back fo skids

Sad outcome for all involved

castellan · 01-08-2014, 07:58 PM

On the road everyone is considered an fool in the eyes of the Law, so you can not have a locked diff.

290GTP · 01-08-2014, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burnz

you blokes have no idea!!!

the car will always want to go left, due to camber of the road.

gas it on anything but a drag strip/raceway. your going for a power pole (left) due to the camber.

So what are you saying?... Cars go left on dragstrips too. Trust me i know.

burnz · 01-08-2014, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 290GTP

So what are you saying?... Cars go left on dragstrips too. Trust me i know.

what side of the dragstrip had more traction? inner outer wheel.
did you break a axel shaft?

been there done that!

STINKY NINJA · 01-08-2014, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burnz

you blokes have no idea!!!

the car will always want to go left, due to camber of the road.

gas it on anything but a drag strip/raceway. your going for a power pole (left) due to the camber.

I think youre forgetting this guy dropped a skid and unwittingly killed his kid,i cant even understand what tangent you are going off on mate!
Camber plays no part in stupidity!

STINKY NINJA · 01-08-2014, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burnz

what side of the dragstrip had more traction? inner outer wheel.
did you break a axel shaft?

been there done that!

A kid has been killed and you just want to start an argument about stuff you have shown you know little about that has nothing to do with this thread... get back in your box!

burnz · 01-08-2014, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STINKY NINJA

A kid has been killed and you just want to start an argument about stuff you have shown you know little about that has nothing to do with this thread... get back in your box!

unfortunate he killed a kid.

but stuff I know nothing about?? sound like your defending a device that should be left to the track.. lack of knowledge on your part!!

290GTP · 01-08-2014, 08:30 PM

Everytime I've "dropped a skid" the car always drifts left first. Road or track. Simple physics, not always due to the camber of the road. Certainly didnt break an axle either.

burnz · 01-08-2014, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 290GTP

Everytime I've "dropped a skid" the car always drifts left first. Road or track. Simple physics, not always due to the camber of the road. Certainly didnt break an axle either.

you have a suspention problem, engine torque twist.

a heavier rear left spring will fix.

290GTP · 01-08-2014, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burnz

you have a suspention problem, engine torque twist.

a heavier rear left spring will fix.

Thanks, your a deadset genius.

burnz · 01-08-2014, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 290GTP

Thanks, your a deadset genius.

you must be feeling enlightened

Trevor 57 · 01-08-2014, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HULK_I6T

they do...

sweeping bend in the wet... wheels must turn at same rate.. opposite lock fish tails for sure.

funny, we have had one fitted to our track car and that has never happened, even after 6 years, wet and dry driving, 2 different drivers, me and my son

Given the right conditions a LSD can do what you are saying, should they ban them as well?

Mind you, I believe spools should only be on track

Definitely driver error is my opinion.

Trevor 57 · 01-08-2014, 09:08 PM

Bit like the gun debate, do guns kill people or do people kill people?

poppa smurf · 01-08-2014, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pottery beige

Have you ever dropped a skid or just preying on aca hysteria

nothing to do with ACA.......why do you always revert to ACA?, some of us see this first hand everyday and don't live in tv land.......this wasn't a spool that was at fault here it was tool.

bit more than "just a skid" it was full blown burnout.........then he hasn't the guts to stand up and take his medicine.......pathetic........up to me he would be facing manslaughter

cars don't just skid, he made it skid, he was acting like a ****** and killed his son.......no sympathy, end of story.

prydey · 01-08-2014, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HULK_I6T

Ive driven a mini spool car on the road and it swung out on me unintentionally.

i may have had the same experience..... in the same car even....

pottery beige · 01-08-2014, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poppa smurf

nothing to do with ACA.......why do you always revert to ACA?, some of us see this first hand everyday and don't live in tv land.......this wasn't a spool that was at fault here it was tool.

bit more than "just a skid" it was full blown burnout.........then he hasn't the guts to stand up and take his medicine.......pathetic........up to me he would be facing manslaughter

cars don't just skid, he made it skid, he was acting like a ****** and killed his son.......no sympathy, end of story.

have a lie down it will make you feel better

XR6Runner · 01-08-2014, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pottery beige

have a lie down it will make you feel better

As much as your posts make my week go quicker and im sure others, give some respect to poppa smurf.

chrisandsharon · 01-08-2014, 11:54 PM

Boy oh boy the tragedy here can't be put into words. Poor little fella.

Don't want to hijack but just a question for the blokes in the know....
Planting your foot with an LSD and traction control? Does the traction control stop the LSD engaging.......im guessing the LSD needs to slip to engage? Not sure, never had an LSD or traction control. Cheers

**cs123** · 02-08-2014, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisandsharon

Boy oh boy the tragedy here can't be out into words. Poor little fella.

Don't want to hijack but just a question for the blokes in the know....
Planting your foot with an LSD and traction control? Does the traction control stop the LSD engaging.......im guessing the LSD needs to slip to engage? Not sure, never had an LSD or traction control. Cheers

The LSD limits differential action with its clutches. You can have one wheel in the air and the wheel on the ground still receives power, unlike an open diff. When the road is wet LSD become more challenging as the friction between the tyre and road is limited and using the throttle in a corner can cause the rear to kick out easily as the tyre has difficulty overcoming the LSD clutches.

Traction control detects wheel spin and limits power from the engine. The LSD action is always there. The only RWD car with LSD and traction control I have driven was the XR6T I used to own. It was a pretty good compromise of limiting power but still retaining positive drive.