P Platers - what are you taught?

[Van D]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

So long as everyone can reverse parallel park tho, right?

I played a gig in the city last week and went in the panelvan, only close place to park was right outside the venue (reverse parallel).. Funny thing was, everyone who was waiting for their gear (ie. my mates) asked if I wanted to go around the corner and park, they just didn't think it was possible to park there. No-one these days seems to like doing them and when you look at people who have, they're always, umm, not quite 'parallel'.

I did the park perfect, wasn't bad a thought for not doing one for months and months and not being able to see out the back!

[Keepleft]

NSW P platers have in fact the nations leading freeway/motorway lane-use text in the "Road Users Handbook".

The driver might have been an interstater in a NSW registered vehicle, or a person from a third world nation (rem - even Asia demands keep left/right at law), OR more the point, - and I'll bank on this, the driver was being an ******** on purpose.

People are not that stupid, cept for the bottom 1% and thats fair dinkum.

NSW we fine you over $300 and you gain 3 demerit points now for failing to keep left >80km/h.


NEWS: - 1. Today the Federal Roads Minister rang 2GO to report a multi-vehicle pile-up that occured in front of him southbound on the F3 south of Mooney Mooney Bridge. Anyone see or attend?

2. It remains a possibility that the F3 limit will reduce to 100km /h max, AND that following the NSW election, the move to remove our 3 x signs on approach to the fixed cameras will be done.

[SNB05T]

Originally Posted by photn

(no offence intended) but if you come from Asia ie China and you have your "licence" from there. you have to do an Australian Test. now if you have learnt all your bad habbits from over there then of course you are going to bring them here. Also what makes it worse is that the written Test can be done in another language. now im all for multiculturalism and all. But come one. If you cant speek or read English then why the hell are you trying to get and Australian Licence. i think thats the Problem with these "asians" as stated. I think they dont really understand how to drive properly or obey the road rules. They just dont simply UNDERSTAND......

second that one. come down to the shire/brighton area. i was following a learner driver car run by an asian company, the learner driver sitting at the lights at rockdale on his mobile while he's learning to drive and the light is green WTF?
one rule for them and one for us. sometimes i wish i was a cop

[holmsy]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Funny story there.

I despise reverse parallel parking. Usually Ill just drive by and hunt for another park, doesn't matter if its right in front of where I want to go, I just could not be bothered.

Until my GF's Dad stayed in town for a couple of weeks. He would take us out to Dinner and naturally, he would point out the parking spots.

Every single damn time I was forced to reverse parallel park, I couldn't tell him that I dont do them because I have a reputation as "the car guy". And what kind of car guy cant reverse park.

So, I did it, wasn't perfect but hey, considering I never do them it was alright. I think Ive done no more than 20 reverse parks in my life, 15 of them were in those two weeks.

Atleast I can do them now without worrying..LOL

i know what its like. iv never had a real problem. in fact i used to do them perfect everytime.
but recently i just seem to keep stuffing them up and coming in to hard and hitting the gutter. in the last couple of days iv done a few in my new ed ( i used ot be in a ba xr6) and iv found i do them fine now. i dont know if the car is shorter or i know where the car is easier or what but i seem to be better in the 10 year older car.

[lukey]

You are taught how to pass the test, that's about it.

Originally Posted by dan b

second that one. come down to the shire/brighton area. i was following a learner driver car run by an asian company, the learner driver sitting at the lights at rockdale on his mobile while he's learning to drive and the light is green WTF?
one rule for them and one for us. sometimes i wish i was a cop

LOL theres one around my area: Hong Kong driving school... As soon as I see one of them I turn down a side street or give a very large berth.

[fordbarbie]

from the original question, yes, P platers are taught to stay left, and even if they're not (and i hardly doubt that) it becomes pretty obvious as soon as you start driving that you steer clear of the right lane unless you're overtaking, speeding, or wanna pis someone off!
i have a question though: the other day i was driving in the right lane (over the limit :p) cause i was turning right a few streets up. there was no1 in the left lane, and i had some women behind me in a subi on my *** and flashing her lights at me. but yeah, i didnt wanna move considering i was gonna turn. it didn't take her long to go around me, but she gave me a dirty look.
was i in the wrong?
please give me some answers. i don't wanna be a bad driver - us chicks have enough of a bad rep as it is :(

[SlowF6]

Originally Posted by fordbarbie

was i in the wrong?
please give me some answers. i don't wanna be a bad driver - us chicks have enough of a bad rep as it is :(

Surely you were not at all in the wrong. When I know I am turning right, I stay in the right lane at the speed limit, regardless of who is tailgating me. :eclipsee_

As for the bad rep you were referring too....pfft! Stereotyping must die! : :

[Hitman]

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

I was doing about 140km/h when he pulled in front of me. Lucky these 4 pots wipe off speed quick!

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

Like I said my instructor actually fell asleep. :

I don't whether that is a bad thing or reasurrance that my driving is excellent.

Doubt it.

[BA Turbo]

[QUOTE=colossus]Question to all recent red P platers - what are you actually taught in your lessons, specifically around motorways?

They were sitting right on their limit of 90km/h (the freeway limit is 100, most people do 120), so due to the difference in speed they had effectivly created a mobile road block.

Yea i know the limit sucks how about the L's 80KM limit when i drive i try not to clog up lanes like in a 100KM zone i go 120 - 80KM depends if i see police ahead.

Same thing hapned to me P plater infront with a hyandai going slow i hoonked the horn n flahed lights and floured it car got to about 100KM in a 50 zone instantly and i just kept floging it and the hyandai moved.

like wtf are these speed limits for the road use to be 90KM now its slowly gone down to 50KM and its up n down hill so its easier for police to catch people like wtf is this years ago people would go 120KM safely on this free way / big wide nice new road

[Hitman]

Originally Posted by BA Turbo

They were sitting right on their limit of 90km/h (the freeway limit is 100, most people do 120), so due to the difference in speed they had effectivly created a mobile road block.

Yea i know the limit sucks how about the L's 80KM limit when i drive i try not to clog up lanes like in a 100KM zone i go 120 - 80KM depends if i see police ahead.

Same thing hapned to me P plater infront with a hyandai going slow i hoonked the horn n flahed lights and floured it car got to about 100KM in a 50 zone instantly and i just kept floging it and the hyandai moved.

like wtf are these speed limits for the road use to be 90KM now its slowly gone down to 50KM and its up n down hill so its easier for police to catch people like wtf is this years ago people would go 120KM safely on this free way / big wide nice new road

Did you proof read that before posting, check for spelling and so on?

You do realise that you just admitted to doing 100 km/hr in a 50 zone and 120 in a 100 zone whilst on your learner's permit.
Whoever was sitting next to you as the 'fully licensed driver' needs to have their license revoked because quite clearly they also have no idea and shouldn't be teaching you how to drive.

So far in this thread we have had a 'P' plater admit to doing 140 kph in a 100 zone and an 'L' Plater doing 100 in a 50 zone, is it any wonder they get bad reputations that they so vigorously deny, it's gotten to the stage now that whenever I see a 'P' plater I wait for them to do something stupid, it seems I now have to look out for 'L' platers aswell.

[MITCHAY]

Originally Posted by Hitman

Doubt it.

Might I add there was never a problem until the ******** pulled out in front of me!

Unlike others I drive to what is suitable to the conditions and what my car is capable of not what a sign tells me.

Perhaps if more did the same there would be less accidents.

[Hitman]

The reason there is speed limits (among other things) is because ******** pull out in front of people, ever thought of that?

And good luck keeping your license if you are too good to be worrying about what a sign tell you to do, just keep on doing it. why conform, be a rebel, I'm sure you can keep the people on the bus amused with your stories of doing 140 in a 100 zone because your'e too good to do the speed limit.

[MITCHAY]

Originally Posted by Hitman

The reason there is speed limits (among other things) is because ******** pull out in front of people, ever thought of that?

Well perhaps they should have done a shoulder check like were taught and would have not pulled out.

On top of that there was no one behind me and he could have safely pulled out in front of nobody if he had of done something dictated by common sense.

Riddle me this. A sign tells me it's 80km/h. Does that mean it is safe to do that speed in blinding rain? Yet many people do it!

[Hitman]

You're not grasping the concept are you?
Take a look at the fatality thread on these forums, what looks to have happened was that the truck driver saw a car miles up the road and thought he could make it, turns out the car up the road was doing nearly twice the speed limit....

an 80k sign or 100k or whatever is the maximum permissable speed end of story, you don't have to travel at that speed if you don't want to, but you can;t exceed it, it's the LAW.

Trying to justify 140 in a 100 zone for any reason is just digging you deeper.

[MITCHAY]

Whatever mate. You make it sound like I was doing 140 as matter of fun. I was doing a speed that was practical to free myself from a state of a congestion.

I'd rather break the rules and risk a fine than have incompetent drivers riding my butt because they don't know how to keep a safe distance. Life isn't just black and white like you seem to put it.

[Hitman]

*last post*

I'm not trying to make it sound like you were speeding for the fun of it, I'm pointing out the flaws in your logic, you say "Unlike others I drive to what is suitable to the conditions and what my car is capable of not what a sign tells me", obviously doing 140 wasn't suitable for the conditions if you had to stomp on the brakes to avoid hitting somebody.

[MITCHAY]

Agree to disagree is all I can say. If I had of not been in a car with such braking power I would have not even tried it.

It's one thing to go fast but pulling up quick is another thing and the majority of cars are not capable of both.

There are numerous circumstances which I have witnessed that technically are legal but not what you would call in the best interest of safety.

[Steffo]

The 90km/h Red P's and 80km/h L's thing is a joke. On my first week on my L's I drove on freeways and such, no problem, and stuck to 80km/h - in the left lane. The amount of people, on a COMPLETLEY CLEAR ROAD that refuse to overtake me with no one in the right lane at all is staggering. Tailgating and highbeams seems more appropriate to them. I guess I'm glad I did most of my L's in a van, as the intimidation factor of cars was way down...

On my red P's I usually stuck to 90km/h in the left lane. It helps that the motorway I most use (M4) is 90km/h in most of the stretch I use it for (Cumberland Hwy overpass to the end at Parramatta Rd, Concord). On my green's, I'm a little bit more liberal with driving faster. It seems an unwritten rule that on motorways, 10-15km/h over won't get you in trouble. I usually sit in the middle lane on the M4 now doing 100 in the 90 zone, in pace with the rest of traffic. Don't try to go faster, but 80-90 on freeways is bad... everyone drives alot faster, its dangerous.

What really craps me off though is people who tailgate/highbeam you etc when you're speeding. Like this one time when I joined the M4 from Parra Rd in Concord, for almost 1km the left lane was full of big trucks and stuff doing 80 (90 zone). I see a clear bit up ahead, right lane (its two lanes at this point, before the Homebush Bay Drive overpass) and take it to 110, easily cruising past them. This ******* in a blue VZ SS came charging up behind me, came damn close to the rear (you couldn't walk between the two cars how close he was) and started flashing the highbeams. So I'm given the option, brake from 110 to 80 and force into a gap in a slow moving car convoy or stay at my speed and pass them. Chose option B, passed them, into the left lane, and he pulled up next to me, obviously ready to attempt to yell/bully me into some kind of fear. Something about driving a small car I guess? Sometimes I wish I was a cop....

[SXCXR6]

hmmm id say if under 80kms an hour there is no requirement to stay in the left lane and somebodys doing the speed limit in the right lane how the hell can you complain when all anybody ever does on this forum is ***** that people dont follow the road rules speeding is illegal if your choosing to do it dont complain when the person in the right lane is doing the speed limit!. But as for over 80kms and with keep left signs my favourite line comes into play "im gonna do a 100 on the high way if your not gonna do the speed limit then get the **** out of my way".

[Airmon]

Cmon guys, you can't have a dig at P platers because they Are following the law.
You have to see it from the P plater perspective aswell. I mean, you try and do the right thing and you cop **** from people on the freeway, and then you cop **** for being a fuggn P plater and being a 'hoon'.
I find I get hassled less when I don't wear my P plates, from both sides of the law.

[ELtim]

90km?

It's 100km here.

[pauljh74]

Originally Posted by xcgxl

Maybe they learnt to drive overseas where they were taught to keep right. Who knows what they are taught because they can get the handbook in any language these days.

A co-worker who lived in China for a couple of years said the breakdown lanes on the motorways were used as overtaking lanes and that there were traffic officers for decoration and proper traffic officers. The former were ignored by many motorists and that as red is considered lucky - running red lights was more prevalent than he was accustomed to here. He didn't actually drive himself while he was there - he was too scared.

[Daymoe]

I'm on my Ls but i'm going to have a dig at some P Plater woman (Woman makes it soooo much worse lol).

I was driving into Goonawarra and there was a T intersection where this stupid P plater comes out and slams on the brakes (supposed to give way to me) and goes into the middle of the road and gives ME a dirty look, so i gave her the finger (My first time ever). Then she proceeds to tail gate me at about 5cm away from the towbar, so dad goes to me turn off here, so i turn on the indicator and slow down, she roars past me beeping the horn and yelling and screaming (In a EA Wagon haha). But she was in the wrong? Then rages at me?

The brake pedal was talking to me and asking me to push my foot on it as hard as i could. Luckily for her i didn't give in.

[paul_r_d]

Every p-plater I have seen, speed past me, cut me off, and play games. The day I see one actually doing the right thing will shock me! I stick to the limit, not slower, not faster. Granted their may be p-platers that do the right thing, but where I live its very rare.
Today we had storms, the rain was that hard people were pulling over and traffic was reduced to 60kms on a 110kms freeway. What do you know.... a crazy cow in an Excel bores past at least doing 100kms. Absolute suicide.

[Fev]

i dont mind reverse parking, but i hate parrallel parking..

answer to your question- Not much at all.. i learn most of it by watching my parents and i pass more bad drivers doing stupid sh.. then i ever have i absolutely hate driving near anyone which is why ive learn to pick lanes usually to get infront of the group pretty much.. i should get my cams license lol

[Keepleft]

Originally Posted by pauljh74

A co-worker who lived in China for a couple of years said the breakdown lanes on the motorways were used as overtaking lanes and that there were traffic officers for decoration and proper traffic officers. The former were ignored by many motorists and that as red is considered lucky - running red lights was more prevalent than he was accustomed to here. He didn't actually drive himself while he was there - he was too scared.

Oh yeah? Whilst accepting that China is not 'all asians' this text is taken from the Chinese driver manual:- note tuition as to three laned freeways, another thread here somewhere about this:-

Translacion:-

A dual carriageway, or divided highway, is a road with a dividing strip between opposing traffic flows. The dividing strip is called the central reservation.

You must not reverse or turn on a dual carriageway or cross the central reservation, or drive against the traffic.

Even if you missed your turn-off, or have taken the wrong route, you must carry on until you reach the next junction.

On a two-lane carriageway, drive in the left-hand lane except when overtaking.

On a three-lane carriageway the normal 'Keep to the left' rule still applies. You may, however, stay in the middle lane when there are slower vehicles in the left-hand lane, but you should return to the left-hand lane after passing them. Do not stay in the middle lane unnecessarily.

The right-hand lane is intended for overtaking only. If you use it, move back to the middle lane and then into the left-hand lane as soon as you can, but without cutting in.

At some junctions the right-hand lane may be used by right-turning traffic.
(KL-This takes into account a 'design flaw' on some older expressways)

This is the relevant bit relating to three lane use in simplified Chinese:-

在 三 行 车 道 上 ， 仍 须 遵 守 「 靠 左 行 驶 」 的 守 则 。 当 左 有 行 驶 较 缓 慢 的 车 辆 时 ， 驾 驶 人 方 可 使 用 中 ， 但 超 越 这 些 车 辆 后 ， 必 须 驶 回 左 边 行 车 。 如 非 必 要 ， 切 勿 留 在 中 行 驶 。

If anything, seems to me QLD, VIC, SA, WA, ACT, TAS need to play catch-up with NSW (where we impart the exact same), and China, GB, EU and the overall governing "UN Convention on Road Traffic", that highlights the above 'requirement' to all remaining states parties!

A year or two ago, China increased its freeway speed limit, from an Australian advocated and adopted one (yes seriously) of 110km/h to one of its own choosing - 120km/h. This lane discipline is one key reason why that is so.

Anyhow, the OP highlights a deliberate action on part of the P plater, no doubt.

[Debzilla_108]

im in QLD and im lucky i got my P's before the 1st of July 2007 (got em in nov 2006)
so i dont have to display P plates

i think the rules are now that you have to display a P plate Red i think...and no green one
and there isnt a speed limit max which is great

ive never lived where there is a limmit for L and P platers...doesnt sound like it works very well....and would be frustrating for other drivers..

[[Tonko]]

Does anybody else realise this thread is a year old?

Having said that, i was tought how to pass my test ;)

[Pinch]

What are P-Platers taught - not much it seems.

Article from my local rag (apt term considering the article) St George/Sutherland Leader that is on point re a P-Plater that rightly got done for fail to keep left.

The Leader almost articluates an 'outrage' that this P-Plater was fined. Even the guy himself said the Police were just picking on him and he "wasn't speeding, so wasn't doing anything wrong". And here ladies and gentlemen is precisely what happens when the Govt is seen to be focusing solely on speeding - other offences don't matter. Good work by the cops for pinging him though.


03 April 2008 - 1:25PM


Fined for slow driving
By Laura Speranza


Outraged: Richard Ossington might lose his licence after he was fined for driving too slowly. ``It's like, because I was a P-plater, they were looking for a reason to pull me over.'' Picture: Wesley Lonergan

WHEN Cronulla P-plater Richard Ossington, 18, decided to listen to his mum's advice to take it easy on the roads, he didn't expect to be pulled over by the police.
The bottle shop attendant was fined $238 and stands to lose four points from his licence after he was pulled over for driving too slow in a right-hand lane.

Mr Ossington was driving at 65kmh in a 90kmh speed zone on the Princes Highway at Loftus/Royal National Park, near Farnell Avenue, on Easter Saturday when officers from Sutherland Highway Patrol stopped his car and issued him with an infringement.

Mr Ossington, who had borrowed his mother's car to drive his brother and friend to Engadine, said he was being extra cautious to avoid the Easter long weekend double demerits.

"It was my Mum's car and she said to me all day to be cautious," Mr Ossington said. "She basically said drive like a pensioner you don't want to risk it."

Mr Ossington said he was not obstructing traffic, and was in the right-hand lane because he had to make a right-hand turn up ahead.

Police told him he could have caused an accident or a road rage attack.

"There was hardly anyone on the road," Mr Ossington said. "It wasn't like cars were having to speed past me."



Mr Ossington said he had maintained a clean driving record since getting his red P-plates a year ago, and was two weeks away from getting his green P-plates.

He fears he may now lose his licence.


"Why didn't I get a warning?" he said. "This isn't going to teach me a lesson because I wasn't speeding so I wasn't doing anything wrong."

A police spokesman said motorists on all multi-lane roads with a speed limit of 80kmh or over were required to keep left unless overtaking, with or without signage to this effect.

"If a driver believes they have been fined incorrectly, they can elect to have the matter heard before a court, where they can put forward their personal circumstances and their recollection of the day in question," the spokesman said.

Jacky Dalton, manager of Trent Driving Schools in southern Sydney, said she was surprised at how hard the police had come down on Mr Ossington.

"If there was no other traffic, and he wasn't causing a dangerous situation, a caution would have been sufficient," Mrs Dalton said.

This is journalism?

Here is my reply:

Absolute support for the highway patrol on this one. Mr Ossington was not fined for driving slowly, he was fined for failing to keep left unless overtaking on a high speed dual carriageway. A driving licence is a privilege not a right (supposedly). For Mr Ossington who studied and got his licence so recently to completely disregard or fail to know the road rules so soon after is a sad indictment of either the testing process or Mr Ossington's attitude to driving. What make matters even worse is that this 'mad mile' (as it is known to regular users) is notorious for this dangerous behaviour and accordingly signs reminding of the road rule Mr Ossington broke are posted all along that area. Turning right somewhere in the next few kilometres is as much as an excuse to this offense as going through a red light and claiming immunity 'as nothing was coming'. This is simply a beat up and hardly worthy of press attention. Instead Mr Ossington should show remorse, accept responsibility for his offending and learn from and and better his driving. Congratulations to the Police for actually enforcing the road rules.

ADDIT: Ossington got pinged southbound near Farnell Ave. The next available right turn into any street is about 3k's. To turn into Engadine itself - about 4k's.