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26-05-2019, 08:06 PM | #1 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Perth, Northern Suburbs
Posts: 5,001
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I fly a lot for work. Everything from tiny turbo-props (which still have autopilot) to modern jetliners that can practically take off and land without pilot intervention. (It can be funny to see pilots put up sun-screens when heading north, essentially flying blind.)
I've never given it a 2nd thought. At various places I've ridden in driverless trains, although to be fair they basically shuttle back and forth, with less complexity than an elevator. My point is that we trust technology all the time. Yet if I arrived in a new city, to find the taxis were autonomous, and it was zipping down the freeway at 100kph, I think I would be soiling myself. In all honesty, I just don't think I could get in one. Maybe in Jakarta, where freeway speeds can barely outpace the hawkers. But then you can hire a driver for about $2 a day, so why put them out of a job. Would you trust an autonomous Merc doing 200kph on an Autobahn? |
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26-05-2019, 08:09 PM | #2 | ||
AKA "the other bloke"
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,977
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Even though I know a auto pilot does most of the boring flying in a plane, I can't say I'd like to be in a driverless car , bus etc. let alone have a driverless truck behind me on the freeway !
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Her's: 2000 AU II Fairmont Ghia 75th anniversary VCT meteorite & 2014 yaris - white His Toy: 2012 fg II GT-E, emperor red His: VS Ute 5 Litre 5 speed (povo pack) His: 2012 FG II GS, Vanish His: 2003 BA GT-P, Lightening Strike Jnr: 2002 AU III Falcon XR6 ST, 5 speed Blueprint & 1978 XC Fairmont Neptune Blue Previous: 1976 HX 50th Anniversary Kingswood 2014 FGX G6E Turbo 1980 XD Falcon GL 2003 BA Falcon XR6 1991 EB Falcon S 1989 EA Fairmont 1982 XE Fairmont 1968 XT Falcon |
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26-05-2019, 08:32 PM | #3 | ||
Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 7,940
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One day in the very distant future, when I'm long departed from this world when all cars on the road are autonomous and no one drives a car themselves, then yes, I would trust them.
But while autonomous cars still have to share the road with stupid human drivers, then no. In the future when all cars are autonomous, they will all communicate with each other in near proximity as to road hazards and what each will be doing in terms of speed, manoeuvres and future intentions on the road. That is something an autonomous car cannot do with a car driven by a human in close proximity and vice-a-versa. ... And there lies the problem IMO. |
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26-05-2019, 08:58 PM | #4 | ||
DIY Tragic
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Sydney, more than not. I hate it.
Posts: 22,308
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I find the mostly good interactions with other road users, an affirming thing. When you stop for a pedestrian out of courtesy; as they smile and wave their thanks, when you let someone into a queue because there’s no reason not to, when everyone works as a team to let the aerosol driver think he’s jumping the pack - but gets the camera flash instead - with autonomy we’d miss that.
Autonomous art would be realism with photos - there’s no room for Manet or McCubbin. Where would writing be, an intelligent machine is still unfeeling; incapable of whimsy or true mischief in prose? For the most part, humans are still inherently capable of being “good” to one another. If we further diminish the social structures of work, respect and feedback, I am certain idleness will lead us astray. It is for these reasons among others, I would not trust or encourage the spread of autonomous vehicles. |
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26-05-2019, 09:46 PM | #5 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,064
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Automation in an aircraft does the job, pilots do the thinking and decision making. Traffic avoidance tech is in a 2 dimensional resolution..ie, one climbs one descends. There is a quantum leap necessary to what people think about automonous cars and it’s capabilities. People will also need to be trained to deal with it. There been a mammoth task in aviation regarding loss of pilot skills due automation and the human/machine interface. It’s a long long road ahead for driverless cars from where I sit. Would I trust one? Nope, not at this point or probably not in my lifetime
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26-05-2019, 09:53 PM | #6 | ||
Cabover nut
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Onsite Eastcoast
Posts: 11,239
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Absolutely
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heritagestonemason.com/Fordlouisvillerestoration In order that the labour of centuries past may not be in vain during the centuries to come...... D. Diderot 1752
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27-05-2019, 06:53 PM | #7 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 546
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Quote:
How old are you ? My prediction it would start trialing in Australia before 2025 and on the roads before 2030. Waymo is already driving is test mode in Denver full Autonomous cars. |
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26-05-2019, 10:02 PM | #8 | ||
Away on leave
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: ACT
Posts: 1,735
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One of my hobbies is 3D printing.. It amazes me how I can print the same thing (even with different colours, having slightly different properties, from different manufacturers) and get the same results (& the same slight defects!)
My day job is in I.T. production support, and it amazes me when I have to tell some team their code from the last release isn't compiling (web browser javascript, mostly). Not compiling, not tested, let alone for the specific change made - moved to production without even looking because of someone's arrogance. No, probably, I would not trust it either - even though I love it. |
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27-05-2019, 01:56 PM | #9 | ||
vbvbvb088
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Melbourne.
Posts: 347
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I was in a Hyundai Kona on road Melb to Geelong... in auto mode it followed paint lines on road for a long time. I was stunned and a bit anxious... if paint lines merged etc etc. Ps - fifth Elent film is where it will be in a long time
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27-05-2019, 02:58 PM | #10 | ||
AWD Assassin
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 8,170
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Not an autonomous car , but a whole autonomous network ! ..........
https://www.timeout.com/sydney/news/...-sunday-052219
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Old RIDE 2006 BFGT Gone but not forgotten New RIDE 2018 AMG Mercedes A45 Angry AWD assassin
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27-05-2019, 05:35 PM | #11 | |||
Former BTIKD
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Sunny Downtown Wagga Wagga. NSW.
Posts: 53,197
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Quote:
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Dying at your job is natures way of saying that you're in the wrong line of work.
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27-05-2019, 04:54 PM | #12 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: NSW
Posts: 4,329
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Not right now.
Sure they can drive down a basic freeway with distinctive lines, but they can't handle less than perfect roads, certain weather conditions and changes to the roads or traffic. Some Tesla Fails https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPMvQphJQiE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMvdI8nSAJE |
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27-05-2019, 06:38 PM | #14 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 546
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Humans fall asleep, speed, take drugs, drink, distracted, suicidal, bad eyesight etc...
Estimated 1.35 million people killed in car accidents in 2016 worldwide according to WHO. Autonomous cars will do better. Any problem with Autonomous cars is due to human error (programmer error or bad design). |
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27-05-2019, 07:07 PM | #15 | |||
Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 7,940
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Yes, I know all 7,706,768,000 don't drive cars, but the 1.35 million deaths also includes pedestrians. People pulling triggers on guns accounts for a much greater percentage of deaths every year.... Maybe we should make fire arms autonomous so we can all be safer. "Alert, alert".... Human detected in gun sight... Trigger has been deactivated. |
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27-05-2019, 07:19 PM | #16 | ||
DIY Tragic
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Sydney, more than not. I hate it.
Posts: 22,308
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Actually, in Australia I believe the number of deaths directly related to bowel cancer dwarfs the number of road user deaths. Yet we have this obsession with "safe driving". Maybe autonomous cars should have a built in colonoscopy function to be properly safe?
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27-05-2019, 08:24 PM | #17 | |||
Experienced Member
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Australasia
Posts: 7,654
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As you said we humans will make mistakes or or just take risks, this is human nature that will not change. Autonomous devices also will not protect us completely as in aviation as one example which has been proven that planes can crash despite pilots trying to override the autonomous devices that fail. Cheers. |
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27-05-2019, 11:25 PM | #18 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Perth, Northern Suburbs
Posts: 5,001
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27-05-2019, 06:40 PM | #19 | ||
*barks incessantly
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: SA
Posts: 1,563
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Of those 1.35 million killed, how many were killed in places like India where the road system is dangerous by it's very nature?
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27-05-2019, 06:44 PM | #20 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 546
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Quote:
See youtube for bad drivers or read the news and drunk or speeding drivers. Its a lottery on the roads, someone is texting or truck driver falls asleep. We are in the transition stage as modern cars are adding semi Autonomous features... which has improved car safety. |
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28-05-2019, 06:36 AM | #21 | |||
Thailand Specials
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Centrefold Lounge
Posts: 49,394
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Quote:
It's a joke driving about this country - Tullamarine Freeway is 6 lanes wide either direction and it's 80km/h - there's a dirt goat track around the corner from where I live with a 100km/h speed limit that links a few towns Interestingly since they've dropped the limit there are a tonne of people still doing 100+ in the 80 sections but weaving in and out of the lanes trying to get around people, it's had the opposite effect, it's just made people drive more aggressively. They can't even get phone reception 50km out of Melbourne and people think that tomorrow we're all going to be zipping around in autonomous cars |
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27-05-2019, 06:59 PM | #23 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 546
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Quote:
Apr 6, 2019, 06:07am https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnkoe.../#502f81c5615b The European Union commissioner for transport expects full self-driving capability by 2030, she said this week at City as a Lab conference in Slovenia. That’s an important part of her “vision zero” to reducing traffic fatalities to none. By 2030 we believe we will have the new generation of vehicles that will be fully automated,” EU commissioner Violeta Bulc said. “This year auto manufacturers added 15 new [safety and automation] features to all cars of all price levels.” Those mandated features on new cars include lane-keeping technology, driver distraction sensors, external sensors, intelligent speed assistance, and a "black box" recorder which can be accessed to help determine causes of accidents. Some of them could aid in making vehicles more autonomous. As commissioner Bulc has overseen and stimulated about 230 billion Euros of investment into European transport initiatives over the past four years. Most of that has gone to mass transit, with 70 percent to railways alone, while private companies have been investing in autonomous driving technology. But Europe is working towards an integrated transport system that incorporates both private and public, personal and mass transit. “Autonomous mobility will not only be about cars,” Bulc said. “It will be about drones, about ships, about trains, about airplanes … my dream is that we bring all this together.” It involves seeing transportation as a service with many integrated components, where a traveller might initiate a trip involving multiple modes of transit with just one digital interface. For example, someone might use a small ride-sharing vehicle to get to a tram, which might then take them to a larger train station. After riding the train close to their final destination, the traveler might use a bus or another ride-share to get to his or her final destination. Making these seamless includes ticketing and mapping. Many if not most of those components will be self-driving or autonomous, Bulc said. That most likely includes aircraft. Built into this vision is decarbonization: a complete transition to electric or other non-polluting engines by 2050. That’s a second leg of Bulc’s “vision zero” strategy: zero pollution. Transport is currently the second-largest contributor to pollution in Europe, Bulc said. (Zero paper in the entire transportation industry, including commercial shipping, is a third.) Bulc knows, of course, that this transition will not happen easily or automatically. “We will achieve nothing without strong ecosystem behind us,” she said, adding that innovation cannot flourish without investment. Ultimately however, Bulc said that achieving mobility as a service requires a focus not on technology or modes of transport but on people. “Don’t get trapped in a small story,” Bulc said. “The big story is about people. It’s not about computers, cars, roads, or drones … it’s about people.” |
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27-05-2019, 07:21 PM | #24 | |||
Former BTIKD
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Sunny Downtown Wagga Wagga. NSW.
Posts: 53,197
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Quote:
The amount she is supposed to have spent equates to $371,904,267,940.00 Australian Dollars. It's doubtful that the Aus Govt has spent a fraction of that on transport since the invention of Horseless carriages
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Dying at your job is natures way of saying that you're in the wrong line of work.
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28-05-2019, 09:28 AM | #26 | |||
AWD Assassin
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 8,170
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Quote:
What about the 3 million other things the car is already doing for you to ensure it runs optimally. Rip out the ECU and then try drive it 10 metres .....
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Old RIDE 2006 BFGT Gone but not forgotten New RIDE 2018 AMG Mercedes A45 Angry AWD assassin
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28-05-2019, 06:10 PM | #27 | ||
black xb
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,254
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28-05-2019, 07:35 PM | #28 | ||
AWD Assassin
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 8,170
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Ha ha fair nuff, but the world has moved on mate....
In reality, with the mix of $$)t drivers on the roads these days, especially those visiting with international licenses etc... id much prefer autonomous vehicles doing the rounds.
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Old RIDE 2006 BFGT Gone but not forgotten New RIDE 2018 AMG Mercedes A45 Angry AWD assassin
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29-05-2019, 10:40 AM | #29 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,125
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Yeah I don’t trust modern automatics either. How can they make cars go faster, use less fuel, increase towing capacity AND still offer the ability for a driver to change gears themselves? Obviously there’s some black magic going on that we just can’t trust.
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27-05-2019, 07:41 PM | #30 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 546
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Anyways you wont have buy or ride in one, but they will start to be on our roads before 2030 along with the drones delivering our parcels.
Australia is usually behind as we are now getting driverless metros. |
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